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TRANSCRIPT - ANN CALDWELL
Interviewee: ANN CALDWELL
Interviewer: KIERAN TAYLOR
Interview Date: JANUARY 27, 2017
Location: CHARLESTON, SC
Length: 72 min.
KIERAN TAYLOR: Make sure we’re—you know all about this, but it’s got to be
up pretty close. It’s a good mic, but not a great mic. Just to get us started and maybe for
the sake the recording?
ANN CALDWELL: Can I hold it?
KT: Yeah, would you prefer to hold it? The only thing—and I might turn this
around and just see if there’s any kind of scuffle noise. But, I think that should be good.
This is a vocalist clearly who wants to hold her own mic. Ms. Caldwell, just for the sake
of ID’ing the recording, can you say your full name and where and when you were born?
AC: My real birthdate? My name is Ann Caldwell. I was born in Denmark, South
Carolina, November, 15 in the 1900s.
KT: That gives us a lot to work with, we’ll leave it at that.
AC: 1952.
KT: Tell me, what was your first musical memory?
AC: My goodness. I wasn’t raised in Denmark, but we occasionally attended
Springfield Church in Denmark, South Carolina. If you’re not sure about where Denmark
is, it’s in Bamberg County. If you are looking at a map Orangeburg sits at the top of
Bamberg County. So, if you are ever wanting to go there, God only knows what for,
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that’s where it is.
But, in the church there was a capella singing. There was a piano, but nobody ever
played that piano. It was still in a heap on the floor when we went back to tend to my
mother’s gravesite. She is buried in the Springfield Cemetery near the church. So, I think
that was kind of my first, if you want to go with a recollection of singing, that’s when I
kind of started remembering it.
KT: Are there specific memories of being in that church and hearing that music?
AC: Not really, because my family moved away from Denmark and settled in
Charleston about 1955. So, whenever we visited it was always in the summer time
because I do not remember Springfield Church in the winter. There was no air
conditioning and maybe there was heat, but we never had to be concerned about it
because we never went back to Springfield in the wintertime. Picnics in the cemetery
yard, stuff like that. It was always services at night. We never went in the daytime.
It was always night services. So, again I had one memory of Springfield where
everybody was singing. There was a lot of singing going on and all of a sudden, the lights
went out. When the lights go out in a place way back in Denmark it gets pitch black dark.
I actually thought I had suddenly gone blind. What was interesting was that the music
never stopped. They never stopped singing. They kept right on singing in the dark until
the lights finally came on again. So, I have that memory of it.
KT: Your memories then of Denmark are not of living there necessarily, but of
visiting and being with family. Do you consider yourself a Charleston native or?
AC: I would say yeah, but if anybody asks I’ll always go back to well I was born
in Denmark, South Carolina and I have to tell you all this because when I get to heaven
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momma’s going to ask me why didn’t you tell them where you were from? So, I have
clearer memories of being in Charleston than I do of being in Denmark.
KT: People who were born in Charleston might challenge you on it as well if
you’re not born here.
AC: They just might.
KT: You were basically three years old or so when you moved to Charleston?
AC: Yeah, my father got a job in Charleston. Denmark is basically a lumber town.
At the time we left, it was dirt roads, lots of wooded areas. Nobody had indoor plumbing,
everybody had the outhouse. I remember outhouses and chicken coops.
KT: Where did you move in Charleston?
AC: I remember 781A East Bay Street. The Sanders Clyde School was where it is
now, but it was all just one story. One story, again dirt yards. There wasn’t a whole lot of
pavement, but that’s where we lived for a while.
KT: I’m thinking about two blocks north of the Cigar Factory?
AC: Yes. In fact, we lived right next door to a lady whose name is Ms. Babe. I’m
amazed at my memory because it’s really bad. But, I remember Ms. Babe. She worked at
the Cigar Factory. I believe her daughter did as well. But, I remember the Cigar Factory
as a cigar factory and not what it is now.
KT: It’s a place to get a $4 cup of coffee today. But, that’s where many working
class Charlestonians, black and white, made a living for the American Tobacco
Company. Where there other musicians or musical people in the family?
AC: Not really. The only person that came close to it was my father who whistled.
I learned to whistle. My mother wasn’t pleased about that because young ladies don’t
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whistle. I’m sorry, I whistled. That’s what I learned from my father.
He never sang, he never played an instrument. He just whistled. I’m the one that
picked up the habit of whistling. My brother didn’t pick it up, my sister didn’t pick it up.
I got it. Don’t ask me to whistle, I can't whistle on command.
KT: I was about to.
AC: I can't whistle on command, it hasn’t happened yet.
KT: At some point, was there a popular music that you identified with and said
yeah, that’s something that really speaks to my experience as a young person? Something
that got you even more kind of involved or interested in music?
AC: I really didn’t become interested in music until I was much older. At that
time everybody knew gospel, and you knew R&B. They had two major radio stations.
One of them was WPAL, that was a black radio station, any artist that was black was
played on WPAL. Whether they were R&B or gospel.
And there was TMA, before TMA became talk radio. TMA played everything
else. So, I kind of bided my time between both of them. WPAL would play gospel in the
morning. Before we would go to school my mother would put on the radio and we’d
listen to gospel music.
Of course, by a certain time of the day the gospel stopped and it went to the R&B,
so we heard groups like the Mighty Clouds of Joy, Mahalia Jackson, Five Blind Boys,
Dorothy Norwood. We heard all those. Even Sam Cooke, if anybody knows of Sam
Cooke. When Sam Cooke was doing gospel.
KT: With the Soul Stirrers?
AC: With the Soul Stirrers. Then there was TMA that was playing everything
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else. Sarah Vaughn the one pop song she ever did was on TMA. George Maharis that did
Route 66. The Drifters. They kind of bided their time between the two different groups,
but basically more of the white artists were on PAL.
KT: How about your church experience in Charleston? Was you family a church
going family and was there music at the church that had any particular influence?
AC: Yeah, there was music in the church. Everybody went to church except
daddy. Daddy had no use for church at that time in life. He went later on, I’m talking
years later. Momma would send us to Sunday school and then she’d come on later.
Everybody would sit in the front row in church because you couldn’t misbehave
with all the kids sitting in the front row because momma could see you acting up in the
back and the preacher could see you acting up from the front. There was a lot of singing.
In the city, they had organs and pianos. So, there was a lot of gospel music. A lot of
gospel and there was probably some spirituals. I didn’t participate in any choirs at that
time, like I said I was grown I guess when I finally got into a choir. But, for the most part
we sat and listened to everybody else sing.
KT: Even through high school, you had no sort of inkling that you might want to
be a musician?
AC: Nope.
KT: Tell me about that then, what are the key sort of steps that made you to begin
thinking about well this might be something that I have some talent for and it might offer
some possibilities?
AC: I was a closet singer. You all wouldn’t know it, but record players were
almost as big as this thing. It was pieces of furniture. There were no headphones. I would
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literally lay down in front of the record player.
At that time, you had records, you could stack them six to a stack and they’d fall
down and play them. I was singing along. I do have that recollection it was, I think, my
mother that kind of made me do something. Again, I was married, pregnant when I sang
my first solo in church. I was singing with a group called the Power of Faith Gospel
Singers. It was a quartet, three women, one guy.
They more or less talked me into doing it. They said you’ve got to sing a solo. I
don’t want to do that. Yes, you’re going to sing the solo. So, I went ahead and did it. I
think two or three weeks later I had the baby, but I did my first solo before my daughter
was born and she is now forty-one. So, that’s how far back that goes.
KT: What church was that?
AC: That was Mt. Zion AME Church. On Glebe Street, it’s still there.
KT: Is that still your church?
AC: No, it is not.
KT: That was one of your churches was down at Mt. Zion. Approaching this first
solo, did that make you anxious, or by that time did you have the confidence to share
your gifts with the public?
AC: I was nervous as all get out, but all the stuff that I had been listening to along
and along kind of played into it because I had been listening to R&B. I had been listening
to pop. I had been listening to the spirituals. I had been listening to Mahalia Jackson and
then there was the Nancy Wilson’s and the Supremes and all of that kind of played into it,
so I was kind of doing stuff in church that nobody else was doing. Do I remember the
first song? Yes.
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I was one of the fewest singers who was ending songs a certain way. With my
soul (sings) nobody was doing that. Where’d that come from? I’m not sure. I did kind of
the ballads in church. I did all the slow stuff. I did not get into the hand clapping thing at
that time.
KT: So, that kind of unique dimension to your singing very early on, was that
reflective of the pop influences or jazz influences? How would you describe that?
AC: That was more of the pop, R&B stuff I was hearing in churches where
improvisation was done. There was a lot of improvisation in the churches. So, I kind of
picked that up and pretty much what I say made my own soup and that was my signature
to always do those highs and lows and kind of mix it up a little bit. As far as jazz, I really
didn’t get into jazz until maybe 1990s. I didn’t hear that much jazz.
It was still around, it’s just that I didn’t travel in those circles. It was always the
gospel, it was always the R&B, pop things. That’s where I was. Pop and R&B, in my
mother’s house was something you didn’t do on Sunday’s. You are not going to sing that
stuff on Sunday’s you have to sing gospel on Sunday’s. Don’t sing that secular stuff on
Sunday’s.
KT: How did that go over? Because I’m sure there’d be some expectation at Mt.
Zion that the gospel music should sound a certain way, that the spirituals should be sung
a certain way. Was there any resistance to your sort of R&B sensibilities?
AC: At that time, there might have been. I was never conscious of it. It was just
common knowledge, everybody listened to the stuff during the week, but then you
listened to gospel in the churches. I think I have a recollection of Sam Cooke getting in
trouble because at the time they called it cross over when he was doing gospel and then
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he was coming back with doing the R&B thing, but he was influenced by the pop. He
brought that into his gospel singing which is kind of probably got him in trouble. But, the
girls thought it was cool. At that time, it’s not that case anymore.
KT: But, the lines were beginning to blur between sacred and secular music I
guess.
AC: The Winans, I would say erased that line with what they were doing with the
contemporary thing. I think the line began to be about invisible about that time.
KT: At what point then do you begin to think about this as a professional career?
AC: I had a regular job and I’d had a regular job for a very long time. I began,
later on after daughter was born, and all that. I began working with a party band. I
initially took vocal lessons and I studied with a woman who sang with the Metropolitan
Opera,[Carolyn] June Bonner. Late June Bonner now. But she understood the importance
of all kinds of music.
So, I was working with her afterwards. But, I had the regular job and one of the
guys said you might want to do something with June Bonner, the vocal thing, and then
somebody else said there’s a guy who has a band. I’m probably ahead of it. Prior to that I
was doing theatre for about three years. It was the guy who was in charge of theatre said
well you might want to get in touch with this guy, he has a party band and he works a lot.
So, I got involved with him and we worked together for quite a few years. I was
the chick singer in the band and, I think, that’s when I kind of started dabbling into jazz
and not knowing that I was doing that. I did something, it was probably scatting or
something, and one of the musicians, George Kenny at the end of the gig came over and
was bowing to me like this. I knew he was into the jazz scene, so apparently, I had done
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something, but it was just a collection of things I hear. Like I said, jazz didn’t really make
its impact on me until about the 1990s. Then I really started to get into it and be involved
with it.
KT: Where were you working and what years are we talking about when you are
kind of doing theatre, but then transitioning into musical performance?
AC: Around 1980s, 90s. I was a draftsman. We didn’t have the politically correct
stuff going on. I was a draftsman on a board, then, when that changed to computer
generated drafting I decided I really don’t want to do that. It was the strain of going to
work in the day, running home, changing your clothes, going out and working with the
band until late at night, going back home and getting a nap because it wasn’t generally
sleep. Getting up, going to work. Hey, we got a gig this weekend. Okay, here we go. We
got a gig tonight and then you go and do that.
And I actually sat down and said I can't keep doing this. I called it the Nestea
plunge. I don’t know if any of you have ever seen the commercial about Nestea plunge
where the guy falls in the pool because that’s what he likens the taste of iced tea to a
plunge. I took the Nestea plunge and I did what they tell you not to do. That is, don’t quit
your... I quit my day job and the following morning I woke up and looked at the ceiling
and said what in the heck did I just do? I’ve been doing it and never really looked back.
KT: I saw a notice from 1982 in the newspaper in which you’re singing at St. Paul
AME in North Charleston, I think, and your billed as a kind of singer/songwriter/folk
person because it’s a singer and guitarist. So, at some point you picked up the guitar.
AC: I did, and I laid it down quite a few times. That was actually my first solo
concert at St. Paul and you’ve got to tell me where you saw that. A lady who worked at
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the postal office found out that I could sing and she asked would you come and do
something? So, it was a children’s concert that I did. I pulled my guitar out, in fact there
is a picture, I can't find it now.
A drawing that someone had taken with me holding a guitar in one hand and
dragging a cross in the other. So, at that point I f I were going to do it for a living I
already decided I’m going to be a gospel music singer. So, that’s what I’m going to do. It
was just like that.
KT: Does that pre-date the party band experience?
AC: Yes.
KT: What was the name of the party band and about when you joined? That’s
something I want to explore a little bit.
AC: The party band came after. I performed with the Porgy and Bess production
that was done in 1990 after Hurricane Hugo. It was the David Archer Band. He is a
booking agent as well. He books different artists. It was kind of interesting and fun.
I got to semi-dress up because I didn’t do the cocktail dress thing, that was just
not me. And I got to play with some very interesting musicians; George Kenny was one
of them, David Archer played the guitar, Charlie whatever his last name was played bass,
and a really weird strange drummer. So, not only did I learn how to sing with these guys,
I learned the nuances in that life. How musicians can be and all that. It was weird, it was
funny, it was interesting. I find all that information a lot more interesting than the music
itself sometimes because there are stories there. But, I started working with David
Archer.
KT: So much I’d like to know about this. Just in terms of your repertoire. I’m
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assuming you’re doing popular R&B covers of the period. Who are you playing to; clubs,
weddings, what are the gigs like? Give us a little bit more of the flavor of the band.
AC: It was a party band. You did the weddings, you did the corporate events.
Most of it because John Kenny and I were the only two African American players, but
most of what we did was cover stuff. Respect played by a predominantly white band is
interesting to say the least, but we were doing that kind of stuff. It was the party music.
Whatever was coming out of Motown.
Mostly The Drifters and what you might call beach music, we call R&B. Others
call beach music. Dance stuff. It wasn’t a performance, we were just playing to an
audience that was either eating or occasionally they’d dance or whatever. It was
background music. If somebody wanted to dance. You’d have the bride and the groom
that would come up and they’d do their first dance. For the most part the kids loved the
fact that we had this really slick dance floor and the kids would be sliding all over that
while you’re playing.
KT: I’m thinking about this from the perspective. You’re a mother. You’re
coming out of a church context and also had a straight corporate job. Tell me about the
night life. Did that pose personal conflicts? You’ve described it as weird and interesting,
but say a little bit more about that.
AC: I didn’t have much of a night life. Out of high school I didn’t date much. I
had a guy that I was dating at the time and thought he wanted to marry me, but he came
to his senses and decided not. That’s fine. Then came the other guy. I was married with a
child. There wasn’t night life per se.
He was a Marine Corps Sargent, so he did his Marine Corps Sargent stuff in the
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day and came home at night. That was life. Hey, I’ll see you later I’m going on a gig.
Make sure Alisson is in bed by such and such a time, I’ll be back. Of course, I’m
divorced now, but that was pretty much it. My night life was around the band. If I didn’t
have the band I probably wouldn’t have gone out.
KT: You said there were some stories from those days, tell us a story that kind of
gives us a feel for the band.
AC: The drummer, I said was a little strange. He was very meticulous about how
he set up his drums. He set them up and then he’d stand back and look at them. Then he’d
go and move the snare an inch or so and then he’d sit down and look around again and
he’d get up and kind of move something somewhere. Now, we’re all standing here
waiting for him to get situated and he keeps doing these little things. You could see the
guys going oh God. I found it quite comical.
I’m just the chick singer. You’re just going to tell me when to sing and I’ll just
sing, but these guys have to wait for you to get set up. Another guy came in, Charlie Chuck, we called him Chuck. Chuck was pretty calm, cool, and mild mannered. But,
Chuck walked in one day with his guitar and bag that held something, I don’t know what
it was. Slammed his guitar one place, threw the bag off and it made this really loud
crashing sound.
We’re going what’s wrong with Chuck? What had happened was, on his way
there his amp fell out of the back of the car and he had to go back to see if he could find
it. He was not a happy camper. It’s stuff like that.
KT: I wanted to go back to the influence of June Bonner who is somebody who
more people should know about in Charleston, I think. Can you talk a little bit about that
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relationship and what that meant to you professionally and personally?
AC: June had a different teaching style or coaching style. I studied with June for
about ten years. This was ten years of walking into her studio doing thirty minutes of
vocalizing. But, we would also do some vocalizing, we talk, we vocalize, we talk, we
talk, we talk, we talk, we vocalize. I think June’s style of teaching prepared us to be
singers not just to sing, but to be singers.
In fact, whenever there were auditions everybody knew who the June Bonner
students were the minute they walked in the room. They just knew who they were. Again,
June appreciated the fact that there was more than one kind of music. This is a woman
who sang with the Metropolitan Opera and decided to leave because in June’s words she
didn’t want to get so old that they’d have to put her out. She was in her late fiftys/sixties
when we first got together.
So, she had most of her singers were active in the theatre. They were doing bands.
They were doing all kinds of music. It wasn’t unusual to walk into June’s studio and hear
them practicing something and you hear all this R&B coming out of the room. June, who
could not dance a lick, would be moving around in the room. You’d hear that and I
appreciate the fact that she was instrumental in making me a singer. In fact, the second
major concert I ever did was a gospel music concert at her club called then, the Coconut
Club. I did gospel at the Coconut Club which was at the old Seamen’s Church on the
Market. That’s where she was.
KT: You worked with her for ten years? At what point does the teaching
relationship end? I’m just wondering how does the mentor say to the mentee “that’s it,
you’re done”. How does that work, I’m curious?
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AC: Just like that. That’s it. You’re done. “Ann, you don’t need to come here
anymore”. It ended just like that. I started working which made it a little difficult to go to
the vocal training thing.
We began talking about different things. I taught briefly for a little while, but it
was about that simple. Ann, she’s the only one who could take a one syllable word and
make it two. Ann, you don’t need to come anymore and away I went. I still saw her. I
would still pop by to talk to June because I had to talk to June. If I were having vocal
issues I would just June, I’m having this issue, can I come by and let me know what’s
going on. We would do that. So, we stayed in contact.
KT: Was the end sudden or had you talked about it before? Was it just one day?
How did you feel about that?
AC: We kind of knew it was coming. It’s kind of like a bad marriage, I guess. The
end is coming and again I never stopped seeing June, I just never kept coming as a
student anymore. We became friends. She was a mentor friend. I always saw June.
Whenever I was performing anywhere June would come and she was careful
never to let us know she was coming. I did a production in Atlanta with a group and the
group came to Charleston to do the production. June sent this enormous floral
arrangement. It covered wherever it was sitting on. Nobody understood, where’d that
come from? Oh, that’s from June. I could barely get the thing in the car, but that’s the
kind of support that June continued to give to all of her students.
KT: You’re imitation reminds me that maybe this is one of your lesser known
talents is your ear for accents and mimicry.
AC: It’s one of the ways that I amuse myself as a child.
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KT: How did that develop?
AC: It just did. I spent a lot of time by myself. I didn’t consider myself street
smart. My brother and sister were. My sister was more street smart than my brother and it
just fell by the wayside with me because I didn’t spend a whole lot of time doing school
activities and such.
I would watch old movies and listening to classical recordings which kind of
drove my father crazy because he’s into blue thing. But, he tolerated his crazy oldest
daughter’s passion for listening to different things. I would listen to old movies and
characters. My thing is “the calla lilies are in bloom”: That’s my Audrey Hepburn thing.
But, it was how I amused myself. I wasn’t thinking about it, I just figured everybody
must be doing this.
KT: So, clearly you have an ear for sounds, music, and voices.
AC: A little bit. Just a little.
KT: I might be jumping out of order here.
AC: I have been.
KT: The Magnolia Singers, how does that come about?
AC: That was formed by, to be honest with you, a guy I was dating at the time
who thought such a group needed to exist. It was about fourteen people strong. When the
relationship came to a close, gladly, I kept the group. It was one of those somebody
would fall apart and I’d go get them and bring them back. Then somebody else would
leave and I’d go get—and I decided let’s not do that.
Let’s see how far the group will fall before it stops falling to pieces. We got down
to five singers and I left it at five singers. We are now six singers strong, but I left it at
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five singers. I could pile five singers into a bus, I could throw them into my car if I had
to. But, I think, we’re into the double digits now that we’ve been together.
We were doing a regular production at the Circular Church called Praise House.
But, what has happened is that somebody’s going to school fulltime, somebody’s going
into the ministry, somebody else is doing this, that, and the other thing. It got the place
where okay, we need to stop right now because there is too much going on. I think we
call it burn out. I think there was some burn out and we did our last performances for the
season in June. We’ve been doing things off and on. We’ve done some festivals, some
concerts, but the group is still intact.
KT: But, not doing the regular Circular gig? What was the relationship between
that and then Sound of Charleston? Was that the name of the program you did, or was
that a whole separate?
AC: That’s a whole separate thing. The Sound of Charleston is a production about
the history of Charleston. So, they covered the Civil War and I covered the spirituals. The
Praise House is mostly the activity that went on in the gathering of the ancestors who
composed the music and their praise house experience.
KT: Say a little bit more about that, as we talked about this interview we went
back and forth over my phrasing of this question or this idea and I still don’t know that
I’m there. But, I am curious about the influence of history and culture on Charleston
music, specifically gospel and spiritual traditions. Can you talk a little bit about that? To
what degree is there a unique Charleston sound with regards to its praise music?
AC: It’s kind of hard to explain the unique Charleston sound. It’s one of those
things when you hear it you know it’s unique to our area. The music was actually
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influenced by the history, especially with the spirituals. When you look at why the
spirituals exist, they had a lot of reasons to exist. They were coded message songs; Swing
Low Sweet Chariot, Wade in the Water. Songs like that were coded message songs that
were used when the Underground Railroad was in its heyday.
The music expressed feelings, emotions, and conditions. If you listen to it, you’ll
hear what was going on around the ancestors. The spirituals is the music of an unhappy
people. People think that the spirituals were sung because this was a bunch of happy
people. They were not. You’ve got to remember back in those days it was nothing like
tranquilizers, Prozac, or Lexapro. They didn’t have all that to make themselves feel good.
The phrase was they came together to sing themselves happy and to shout their
troubles out. What is amazing to me is after doing that they went right back into the
situation that caused them to have to sing and shout. This was their way of surviving. The
music is documentation of what’s going on around them. Lots of songs did that. There
are folks who say oh that’s just slave music, no listen to it and find out what they’re
doing.
If you listen to the blues, the blues does the same thing. The blues describe
feelings and conditions. The rhythms were used, sometimes in the fields as work songs
and I’ve seen them used on chain gangs as well, to set the pace of work. When the song
was sung fast the pace of work was fast, when the song was sung slower the pace of work
was slower. Sometimes, when they couldn’t stop they would use the slower pace to rest
when they couldn’t stop because you could get into trouble if you were not in the right
rhythm. If somebody’s working too slow and everybody’s working real fast.
You’d get beaten pretty severely. What they do is to use that rhythm to ‘draw
�Ann Caldwell
18
level the angel I’m coming down’ (sings) and when you’d speed it up ‘draw member,
draw’ (sings). Everybody is doing the exact same thing, so if everybody is slow together
nobody’s getting in trouble. When it was used as coded message songs. Swing Low
Sweet Chariot, the chariot was the Underground Railroad and when it talks about the
chariot swinging low, if something is swinging low it’s close. So, that was the signal that
was given whenever it was time to leave the plantation to go up north to Canada which
was also referred to in the music as Canaan.
It was either called Canaan, home, promise land, heaven. So, the music had its
meaning. I would think that life determined what the music was going to be. It’s kind of
like feeling bad music, break up music. We know what happens, we break up and we
want to hear a song about breaking up. There are artists who write songs about breaking
up. It’s the activity that causes the music to be born.
KT: Is that African American music? Or is that Low Country music?
AC: It was born in the Lowcountry. When you think the slaves came through
here, African Americans created it. A lot of it was created here. The musical activity in
Charleston covers spirituals, blues, R&B. It was born here because the ancestors, I took
to calling them, created this music out of their own life, their hardship.
The slavery trade was pretty prevalent here. It is said that Amazing Grace, though
the lyrics were created by John Newton it is said that the melody sounds like a west
African sorrow chant. I asked myself the question, where would he have heard a West
African sorrow chant? He was a slave trader. He’s going to hear it on that boat. So, they
brought that here along with the rhythms.
KT: As you’re developing as a vocalist, as an artist, had you had the opportunity
�Ann Caldwell
19
to spend much time in Johns Island churches or Wadmalaw churches to hear—I’m
curious whether there were distinguishing characteristics between the Sea Island
experience and the peninsula experience.
AC: I’ve even been told that there are. There was a woman that I knew from a
church I attended that when she heard a song sung a certain way she said oh they sing
that differently out on James Island, or they sing that differently out on Wadmalaw.
Yeah, there is a slight bit of difference in how it’s sung on the different islands. Yeah,
that does exist. I have sung in those churches where you can kind of hear it. There is a
difference.
KT: We’re running up against the problem, I think, of talking about music
because so much of this is intuitive and you know it when you hear it. You almost hate to
reduce it to words. It challenges our ability sometimes, I think, to describe those kinds of
nuances. I gather as a musician you feel it instinctively, but it might be hard to actually
pinpoint it and say yeah that’s why that sounds differently to me.
AC: I think that you kind of want to look at the similarities because when you
perform this kind of music in the settings that you do. African American people are very
passionate people. They love their power in music, be it spirituals, gospel, R&B,
whatever. There’s a reason behind the singing. Nobody just stands and sings.
People can relate to the song when it is sung. Even if the former President of the
United States sings Amazing Grace people grab hold of that because they connect with
the words in the song, the feelings, the emotions, and the activity. We are very animated
folks. We have the Usher’s March and the stomp and the ring shout and all that. There is
movement.
�Ann Caldwell
20
There is a lot of feeling and emotion in it. That’s the thing that makes all of it
similar. We don’t even hardly pay attention to the nuances. We just know. We’re just
having a wonderful time singing this stuff.
KT: Magnolia Singers bill themselves as presenting and correct me on the
wording here, but Gullah spirituals. What does that mean? Are you a Gullah artist?
AC: A lot of it is commercial now where you use the name. Let’s throw Gullah in
here and draw people into it. Gullah is a language. They talk about Gullah and Geechee.
Gullah kind of pertains to the inhabitants of the Sea Islands along South Carolina.
When you say Geechee then we’re talking of the inhabitants of Sea Islands along
Georgia. They are intertwined. You can interchange them. But, it’s the language. When
you talk about spirituals as opposed to gospel.
Spirituals had their birth in rural America when they were used in churches that
didn’t have musical accompaniment. They were out in the fields, you didn’t have that as
opposed to the gospel that moved into urban America where you had the accompaniment
and the message was now different. With the spirituals, we’re talking about the hope of
freedom. Once freedom presented itself and we had it the plantations went belly up.
We’re into urban America singing something different.
We have a different hope. The ancestors were people who had a lot of hope. A
hope of freedom, that came, then a hope of equality. Hearing the good news in the gospel
music because that’s what it means good news. The message changed. So, with the
Gullah we’re using the language. I’ve heard folks sing Kumbaya. Kumbaya, my Lord,
Kumbaya. Lord how come (00:52:14).
When I did the theatre, I did a line that said “sing for the (00:52:21) up the sky.
�Ann Caldwell
21
Sing for the live oak what stands so high. Sing for the people’s working the ground,
(00:52:26) their music (00:52:27) their music. (00:52:28) the sound”. It’s the language of
the ancestors. That’s who sang them. So, you’re going to hear that in what you call the
Gullah spirituals.
KT: It’s a term that changes depending on context. I know that I’ve spoken with
an older person from Johns Island for whom Gullah is an insult. That was something that
you were called. If you were Gullah it might suggest that you were country or you
weren’t sophisticated somehow. But, I think the notion of the term has changed over time
and it changes depending on who is talking.
AC: Actually, the word Geechee was the offensive word. If you were called
Geechee it wasn’t such a good thing. But, then that changed. They are interchangeable.
KT: What is the distinction there? What would it mean to be Geechee as opposed
to Gullah?
AC: I don’t think there’s much of a distinction.
KT: Yeah, but why would that be offensive and Gullah not?
AC: I’m not sure why and I was kind of amazed myself when I was first
introduced. Geechee, hmm, you just Geechee which kind of has the connotation that
you’re probably thinking of.
KT: A little rough too?
AC: It has to do with tribes. The Gullah word possibly comes from the Angola
tribe which supposedly was the first tribe that was brought into America for the slave
trade. So, it goes back to different tribes. But, it started out being offensive. I don’t think
it lasted very long. But, again it divides South Carolina from Georgia.
�Ann Caldwell
22
KT: So, you’ve performed for diverse audiences. I’m thinking about not only
white/black, but you’ve performed for a lot of tourists. I’m wondering if you just speak to
the public response to your singing and whether you see difference in the audience
reception and contexts. I am thinking that singing at Mt. Zion is different than teaching at
Circular, which is different than singing in an African American church on James Island.
Can you say a little bit about that?
AC: In regards to the spirituals do you mean?
KT: Really just any of your performing and how it’s received by different
audiences.
AC: It all depends on the arena. There is performance and then there’s
background. When you’re in a restaurant be it tourists or locals it’s background. There
are those who would like to hear it, but because of the noise going on in that particular
arena. Performance wise is totally different.
There is not much you can tell about being in a restaurant or a party or wedding
reception. People are there for another reason which some folks say aren’t you bothered
that people are making so much noise? It’s a restaurant, they have come here to eat,
drink, pick up a date, and go home. They are not here to hear me. Where performances
are different.
I’ve been fortunate to perform for various and sundry different types of people
and there are listeners. There are those who like to listen to the music. They like to hear
music done well and they respond to it. They are very receptive. Most of my audiences
are Caucasian, for spirituals, for anything.
People have their style of music. You have your jazz audiences that come out in
�Ann Caldwell
23
mass for the jazz. There are those who like the beach music. I had the pleasure of doing a
Pete Seeger concert with a friend of mine. There were people everywhere because they
could relate to the Pete Seeger’s, so we got to do that music. People like their music.
So, they will come out for their music. We did Women and Bowie, Women and
Young. We did all these different tribute shows. The funniest one was the Women and
Young where he does a song where somebody’s playing a broom. So, they decide I’m the
one that’s going to play the broom. I had never heard the song before. So, they said
you’re going to play the broom.
We found a way to get the broom sound. I’m sitting there and it was weird
because you can sense in the audience when people are waiting for something. They are
sitting here waiting for the broom solo. All I did was—
KT: This was Neil Young?
AC: Yeah, he did a song, I can't remember the name of the song. I didn’t even
sing it. I was just playing the broom. People have their music that they like. You can
sense things from an audience.
KT: I have so many more questions to follow up with you, but I do want to open
it up to see if there are questions from the group. Anyone want to jump in there? Because
I think we’ve got about 10-15 minutes. Yeah, Mr. Galloway.
GALLOWAY: You said you have kids, what do your kids do? Did your kids
follow in your footsteps at all?
AC: I have a daughter and two grandsons. My daughter is in health care. My
youngest grandson fancies himself a rap artist. He has been going into the studio. He’s
really quite good. The other one is into girls and snakes.
�Ann Caldwell
24
KT: Mr. Rice.
AC: Good morning.
RICE: Going back to what you said when you said the slaves had music. They
sung themselves happy and shouted their troubles out and then the chain gang and how
their pace determined how fast they worked. Today the singers in this day and age like
The Citadel Gospel Choir they sing for the mission of making Jesus famous. We love our
Jesus famous. I wanted to ask you what is one of your motivations? What are your
reasons for singing?
AC: Mine is a gift, a God given gift and I frankly feel obligated to sing. My
mission statement is to encourage, enlighten, enhance, engage. As long as I am doing that
with anything I do, especially in singing I am fulfilling my purpose. I think there was a
line in Chariots of Fire where one of the runners says “God made me to run fast and when
I run I feel his pleasure”. God made me to sing. When I sing, there are moments when I
feel his presence and his pleasure. It’s a gift he could have given, and probably has, given
somebody else in this room. But, that’s my take on it.
It is a God given gift. I am obligated to do with it what needs to be done. Whether
it’s gospel, blues, jazz, whatever and to keep it clean. There was a time when it wasn’t
thought wise to cross over, but in order to get into certain arenas, like I said I thought I
was going to be a gospel singer, but the pull wasn’t in that direction. Now, I find myself
in arenas in the company of people I would not have been in the company of had I stayed
in the gospel genre. Did I answer that?
KT: I think of you singing in these tribute shows singing David Bowie and Neil
Young. It is my sense that this is something of a new development in Charleston music.
�Ann Caldwell
25
These shows that, I think, bring together artists coming from diverse genres, but also
these are racially diverse and often times women led initiatives these shows. I am
wondering if you can, in your perception, how has the Charleston music scene changed in
recent years? What do you think has brought about some of those changes?
AC: It’s changed pretty much in the fashion that you’ve said. It brings together
divers audiences and its music that everybody can relate to, but I like the fact that we do
now have the diverse audiences. Whites as well can come to the gospel concerts. I hear
people say all the time man I remember when I was a child I heard black folks singing
gospel music and I was afraid to go into the church. What do you think would have
happened if I’d have gone in that church? I said they’d have said good of morning, give
you a bulletin and tell you to sit down.
But, now they are happening in arenas that are comfortable for people to walk
into theatres and music halls. A lot of the restaurants now are introducing gospel
brunches for people and people are flocking to them. I like the idea that the audiences are
now diverse and we’re reaching out to different people that we probably would not have
been in the vicinity of. They were listening to them, it’s just that they were listening over
here. Charleston, on Sunday morning was the most segregated day of the week and that’s
really not the case much anymore, especially with the mega churches and such.
KT: Other questions or comments? Anyone?
AC: This is your last chance. You’re going to wonder.
Woman voice: Ann Caldwell. Ann Caldwell. Then you’ll say oh snap.
KT: I have maybe a couple that we can squeeze in. Through the Magnolia
Singers, you’ve had some national television exposure? Or do I have that wrong?
�Ann Caldwell
26
AC: No, we’ve done the Today Show a couple of times and we sang in the
presence of Phylicia Rashad and somebody else who’s name I can't remember, it’ll
happen to you when you get this age. But, yeah, we’ve had a little bit of exposure.
KT: National TV. I would think more people watch those morning programs than
just about anything.
AC: I never do.
KT: I don’t either.
AC: It just goes by too fast. Okay, you get a snippet here and you’re gone.
KT: Was that just another gig? Were you anxious around that?
AC: Somebody said you’re going to do the Today Show, go do it. Kathy Lee was
there and all that. We sang and we were gone. It just comes and goes so fast. You’ve got
this many minutes to do something and then get off and go away.
KT: I also wanted to know, how has the Emmanuel massacre reflected in through
the musical community or how has the musical community changed or responded to the
events of the past year-and-a-half?
AC: I don’t believe the music has changed. It’s the medicine we lean on. It’s the
strength in the music. The music is still doing what the music has always done. It’s the
reason Barak Obama, who is not a great singer, can sing “Amazing Grace” and get the
response that he gets.
If you listen to those lyrics “through many dangers, toils, and snares we have
already come. It was grace that brought us safe thus far and grace will lead us on.” The
music is still doing what the music has always done. I think the whole incident has drawn
us closer as a people and what happened with the Emmanuel Nine is not unique to us. It’s
�Ann Caldwell
27
having things happen and immediately lean on the faith.
That was the first thing that happened when we all heard that. We just went to
prayer. We went into what we usually went into when this kind of tragedy strikes. We’ve
been living with this since we set foot in America. You had four little girls that were
bombed in a church in Alabama.
People who’ve been hung and beaten to death, we always went back to the faith
because we believe. It’s the hope that things will one day get better. Who was it, Sam
Cooke, did a song about the time that they singed the Civil Rights bill. Change going to
come. You always hear that hope.
You will always hear the hope in the back. Why do we forgive? Because it’s
better to forgive than not. I believe Mandela that said not forgiving is like swallowing
poison and waiting for the other person to die. We have to keep going.
The opposite of perseverance is to stop. When you stop, when you don’t forgive
you can't move on. There is still the hope, even today. We will always hope because
that’s the kind of people we are and we keep moving on. We celebrate our little successes
along the way.
When we finally got freedom that was something we celebrated ‘Free at last. Free
at last. Thank God all mighty, I’m free at last’ (sings). When we got past that and came
up to Civil Rights. They had to sing a bill for us to have stuff we should have been born
with.
Then the Civil Rights songs that preceded Civil Rights and came after Civil
Rights. Okay, we celebrate that little victory there and then we move onto the next thing.
Now, it’s justice. Justice, in my mind, seems to be the hardest thing for us to have. We
�28
Ann Caldwell
still don’t feel as though justice is equal, but that’s a victory again we will celebrate when
it’s time to celebrate and then move to the next thing.
KT: Thank you very much for coming to class.
AC: Thank you.
KT: Great.
End of recording.
Edited ML 4/17/2017
�
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Oral Histories
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The oral histories in this collection were produced by The Charleston Oral History Program at the Citadel. Founded in 2008, The Charleston Oral History Program at the Citadel seeks to deepen understanding of the Lowcountry’s rich history and culture through the gathering and presentation of recorded memories from area residents.<br /><h3>Search Tips</h3>
Interviews may be browsed by scrolling to the bottom of this page and selecting "View all items".<br /><br />When using the search bar, we recommend putting quotations around your search term, and selecting the Boolean search option, as illustrated here:<br /><p><img src="https://gdurl.com/aYPj" alt="aYPj" /><br /><br />To view interviews of a specific theme, please see the search tips in each series below.</p>
<h3><strong>The Citadel in War and in Peace<br /></strong></h3>
With generous support from the <a href="http://www.schumanities.org/" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer noopener">Humanities Council of South Carolina</a>, The Charleston Oral History Program at the Citadel collected thirty interviews with Citadel alumni regarding their experiences during WWII. Journalist and historian Jack Bass conducted the interviews during the Fall of 2008.They serve as a powerful testament to the veterans' experiences and their critical contributions to the war effort.<br /><br /><em>*To search interviews in this series, use the following terms utilizing the Boolean search option:</em><br /><ul><li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace"</li>
<li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace -- World War II"</li>
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<li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace -- The War in Afghanistan"</li>
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<h3><strong>Working Charleston</strong></h3>
Working Charleston documents the on and off job experiences of the longshoremen and lawyers, the bartenders and carriage drivers, hospital aides and high tech workers who make Charleston among the nation's prime tourist destinations and vital centers of global trade.<br /><br /><em>*To search interviews in this series, use the following terms utilizing the Boolean search option:</em><br /><ul><li>"Working Charleston"</li>
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<h3><strong>Charleston and the Long Civil Rights Movement</strong></h3>
<span><span>These interviews explore how community activism continues to shape modern life in the South.<br /><br /><em>*To search interviews in this series, use the following terms utilizing the Boolean search option:</em><br /></span></span>
<ul><li>"Charleston and the Long Civil Rights Movement</li>
<li>"Civil rights movement--South Carolina"</li>
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<span><span>This project is designed to raise the profile of the Hispanic/Latinos who call the Lowcountry home and to promote a rational and humane conversation regarding immigration, education, and employment policies.<br /><br /><em>*To search interviews in this series, use the following terms utilizing the Boolean search option:<br /></em></span></span>
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<h3><strong>Women in World War II</strong></h3>
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Publisher
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Citadel, the Military College of South Carolina
Oral History
A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge.
Interviewer
The person(s) performing the interview
Kieran Walsh Taylor
Interviewee
The person(s) being interviewed
Ann Cadwell
Duration
Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.)
1 hour, 12 minutes
Location
The location of the interview
Charleston, South Carolina
Dublin Core
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Title
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Oral History of Ann Cadwell, interviewed by Kieran Walsh Taylor, 27 January, 2017
Subject
The topic of the resource
Women musicians
Women musicians, Black
African American musicians
African Americans--South Carolina
Description
An account of the resource
Singer and storyteller Ann Caldwell was born in Denmark, South Carolina in 1952. Her family moved to Charleston when she was three years old. Her early musical memories relate to church music and the long hours she spent listening to gospel and R&B on the radio. However, her interest in pursuing a professional musical career would develop much later. She was an adult when she had her first solo concert at St. Paul AME Church in the City of North Charleston in 1982. In the interview, Caldwell recalls the challenges of being a working mother and a party band singer as well as her experiences singing with the David Archer Band. She also talks about the Magnolia Singers, a Charleston-based vocal group she founded, which gained national recognition. Caldwell reflects about what it means for her to perform Gullah Spirituals, the music of her ancestors to different audiences. She discusses her participation in programs and events with musicians of different styles and traditions such as the Women & Series at the Music Hall and talks about what it takes to be a working musician in Charleston. Finally, she reflects about the Charleston music community response to the Mother Emanuel tragedy and affirms, “I don’t believe the music has changed. It’s the medicine we lean on. “
Creator
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The Charleston Oral History Program at the Citadel
Source
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Working Charleston
Publisher
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The Citadel Archives & Museum
Date
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2017-01-27
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Materials in The Citadel Archives & Museum Digital Collections are intended for educational and research use. The user assumes all responsibility for identifying and satisfying any claimants of copyright. For more information contact The Citadel Archives & Museum, The Citadel, The Military College of South Carolina, Charleston, South Carolina, 29409.
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application/pdf
Language
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English
Type
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Text
Identifier
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https://citadeldigitalarchives.omeka.net/items/show/611
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Charleston (S.C.)
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Text
TRANSCRIPT - LEAH SUAREZ
Interviewee: LEAH SUAREZ
Interviewer: JONATHAN TAYLOR, DENNIS JOYNER, RILEY FRANKS
Interview Date: APRIL 6, 2017
Location: Charleston, SC
Length: 69 min.
JONATHAN TAYLOR: My name is Jonathan Taylor, I am a sophomore.
LEAH SUAREZ: Johnathan, nice to meet you.
JT: Nice to meet you.
DENNIS JOYNER: I’m Dennis Joyner.
LS: Dennis, it’s nice to meet you as well.
RILEY FRANKS: I’m Riley Franks
LS: Riley, it’s nice to meet you. Good morning everyone, it’s nice to be here.
Thanks for having me, Kerry and Marina. I’m very happy to be here.
KERRY TAYLOR: You’re good, yeah, take it away.
JT: Awesome. So, I guess the first question that I have is were you always
involved in music? Like in your youth when did it really start where you wanted to
pursue vocals and jazz?
LS: Vocals and jazz specifically? Or music in general?
JT: I guess we can start with music in general.
LS: Okay, that’s a great question. A good place to start. I think music has always
been a part of my life. I think it’s really a part of everyone’s lives in our culture, maybe to
some others its more pronounced and prominent. My mom was a gospel singer and piano
�Leah Suarez
2
player, played by ear.
She always made it a point to have an upright piano in the house, even though my
father hated it. Church was very important growing up. I was in the choir and kind of
loved sitting at her feet. That was her downtime. She was a nurse really by trade and
teacher and worked three jobs and would just come home and play and sing.
She and her sisters had a trio. For me growing up, I think, that was really
profound. Musically, I didn’t really get started with my formal training until that time. I
really honestly dreamed of being in Westside Story. Secretly I wanted to be Anita. I
wanted to be her character that was me. But, really you have to tell everybody you’re
going to be Maria because that was way more digestible for at least parents and the
outside world. I also thought I was going to be Aldonza, Dulcinea in Man of La Mancha.
As a young girl, I think that was a really interesting time before I got into formal
training in band. And then my interest changed, jazz wasn’t really what I — I didn’t
realize the Tin Pan Alley tunes were what you considered jazz at the time. I actually had
a classical background on euphonium which is a tenor tuba. Went to band instead of
chorus. I have three older brothers and a half-brother, who I never lived with.
They would hear the sounds coming from my bedroom and tell me some very
inappropriate things, as brothers do. It was honestly kind of traumatic in a lot of ways.
That was a traumatic time in my life. Music, at that point, became my salvation, my
refuge, my point of peace if you will.
JT: Would you say that you working with your mother and also her trio that she
had that cohesion with the whole group; would you consider that part of your salvation,
just working together? I guess music accomplishes —
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LS: I appreciate that question. Let me be a little more clear. She actually got
married when she was fourteen to my father and she came from the upstate of South
Carolina. That is where she had her gospel trio with her sisters. They were called Page
Three because their last name was Page. She was the eldest of the sisters, so when she
left that was her salvation and she sort of left that church as well which was a big thing
then, especially for Pentecostal Holiness and a lot of interesting things came out of that
area of the state especially.
Interesting mixes of people and religion. So, when she left I think that was her
way of finding some solace and she definitely passed that down. There was very little
said about it, I always remember that being important to her. We would always sing in
the car because once we got in the home we couldn’t really sing if my brothers or my dad
were there. That was also a female mother daughter thing. When we had a relationship
that was really the closest we could be to that. I appreciate your questions, thank you.
JT: Other than your mother, were there any other teachers or maybe some peers
that influenced your early musical career?
LS: How long do we have? (laughter) I really thought about this question a lot
lately. Yes, early on. I think one of my brothers had a great influence on me because he
would send me mix tapes. He moved away, all three of my brothers were soccer players
and they moved away and were traveling the world.
I was the fourth son that my father never had and that’s part of my story. I have
twin brothers and a brother who is younger. He would send me postcards and letters. I
would wear his jersey when he was gone. I was a total tomboy too. I just missed him that
was my way of being close.
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Having somebody there for me. He would send me mix tapes and because he was
traveling the world I was so infatuated with what he would send me because he was
around so many different kinds of people and seeing so many different kinds of places.
That’s when I first head Dizzy Gillespie. Then you find out oh my gosh, he’s from South
Carolina and what is this sound? What is this mix of all these things I love? He’s playing
horn but he’s also singing and he’s playing these Latin rhythms with these musicians.
He’s an ambassador. That all made sense to me then.
I think he doesn’t really know it probably, my brother, how profound that was,
but when you’re nine, ten, eleven and you are going through excuse me, but some shit in
life. You like the real stuff. You grasp onto those kinds of things. That was a way to get
out and see the world. Other influences, my band director for sure in positive and
negative ways.
I say negative, but they were life changing ways, but definitely influenced
discipline. I think my father hated that I gravitated to music so much that it was almost a
great push for me. He was a great influence for me, in a lot of ways, for me to continue
on this artistic path. I was an athlete as well and you chose a different path. It’s not
always welcomed.
JT: Considering that you stuck around in South Carolina, most of your brothers
were traveling around the world and they were exposing you to various cultures, would
you say that some of the mix tapes he sent back to you, could you tell any cultural
difference? This doesn’t sound like South Carolina, this definitely sounds like —
LS: For sure, at the time, they really were mix tapes. They were actual tapes. I
guess how you would explain it now is like a Spotify mix that you would send somebody.
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But, then you actually have your magnetic tape and you’re recording it. It’s crazy to think
that it’s not really a thing now. I never really thought about that. I have them all. I have a
cassette player and it’s actually a great form of archiving.
Eventually everything wears out and we are trying to figure that out now, but
these mix tapes, for me it was also about the packaging. He spent a lot of time in writing
everything out, would put the duration of the songs; would curate essentially music for
me. Would curate music that he thought I was interested in or that interested him. Some
of it would be, of course, I didn’t understand it until ten years later, but that’s what made
it so special. It would be a happy Valentine’s Day and it would be Miles Davis, “My
Funny Valentine” mixed with Ahmad Jamal.
You are hearing all of these great sounds. So, that definitely helped. We did travel
because of soccer as a family. I think just being exposed to other languages too. Music is
very much a language and it’s such a cultural center of a society and a community and
how people gather.
So, when you are in any part of the US or of the world, especially other parts of
the world not only are you hearing different languages in speaking and how we
communicate person to person interpersonally at dinner, which is a huge part of that too,
which is the meal, the food. Whether its food, sports, art; that kind of thing. But, music
was always a centerpiece whether we knew it or not. Whether you were staying in a
monastery at a church and you hear the bells. All those things, it’s music.
JT: For your musical career, did you travel at all, or is your traveling mainly just
you around with your brothers for their soccer competitions?
LS: When I was young? We traveled a lot as a family in that way. Always in a
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van or on a plane or whatever that was. In band, we did just a lot of state and regional
traveling and then national eventually. I went on to George Mason University for my
study on euphonium.
I went to North Carolina first and played there and then D.C. and really loved
being in D.C. because that’s also a mecca where you can meet so many different kinds of
people, such an intersectionality. Past that I came back to College of Charleston and then
went to Copenhagen on tour. That was really my first experience on my own as a band
leader leaving this place. Leaving the comfort of not only Charleston, but I think the US
in a very deliberate way. When you go somewhere else, no matter where that is, you can
be who you want to be and who you need to be.
I think there is something really special about that and finding your identity as a
young person. Musically as well. When I got there it hit me like a ton of bricks. I was like
oh right, I’m at the Copenhagen Jazz Festival and I’m representing something. I’m also
representing myself, who is that person. I was twenty-four at the time. You’re probably
twenty?
JT: Twenty.
KT: They are all a little younger.
LS: I think, especially for a woman who was turning twenty-four. I was married at
the time and it was just such a profound moment. We were staying in a hotel with some
of the greatest musicians in the world. At the prominent hotel where all the jazz
musicians stayed at the Copenhagen Jazz Festival and we were the nightly house band.
We played in the festival and we had a recording at [00:12:51 Steinway] Hall. All of
these things.
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What was supposed to be a six-week tour turned into me calling my husband and
saying I don’t know when I’ll be back. Needless to say, we’re not together anymore. Six
weeks turned into six months for me and I literally cashed in everything I had and I slept
on a floor. I was the happiest I had ever been. I needed to heal there and I wrote a bunch
of music that a lot of people have not heard yet. These kinds of experiences, that sort of
set everything on fire and I just said okay however I can travel playing music that’s how I
want to communicate and be in the world and move in this world.
JT: Awesome. Well, I think I’m going to pass the mic along.
LS: Thank you.
Dennis Joyner: My questions are mostly going to be mostly around your music
career and performances and your recording that you did. I think you touched on it
earlier, but could you describe what your first performance felt like, how you felt going
in? Just the experience in general?
LS: As an instrumentalist, young or as a professional?
DJ: Professional.
LS: Wow, these are great questions. I was terrified because also singing is very
different than performing on an instrument. I remember when I moved back here, I had to
move back here because I had surgery on my mouth so I could no longer play my horn at
the level, I was going to be in the Marine band that was my goal. Get to D.C., be in the
marine band and play. That was my life dream. That’s all you can do as a euphonium
player to be fair.
There are many service bands you can play it. I have a lot of respect for that and a
lot of friends who play. Finding my voice here was really a different thing because you
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are also as vulnerable as you can be. Using your singing voice is much different than
speaking and public speaking. It’s really naked and really raw. That’s how I felt.
I don’t know that you ever get used to that feeling. I think you learn how to
embrace it and learn how to use it for good and channel that energy. Nervous is how
terrified, naked, and also really excited. There is something that clicked in that
performance that I just knew that this is what I was supposed to be doing.
DJ: Where was your first performance at?
LS: My first pro gig was actually at the Charleston Grill, the Charleston Place
Hotel and I got my ass handed to me [laughter]. That was really humiliating. To be fair, I
was a student in a lot of ways. You’re always still learning. But that gig was— actually I
shouldn’t say that, I should say this, it was at the Charleston Grill, that’s all you should
know.
DJ: Out of all the recordings you did, what would be your favorite if you had to
pick one?
LS: Recordings that I’ve personally recorded? The only one that I really did. I
technically have two EPs which stands for extended play, extra play; when we used to
actually have records. Everyone has seen a record? Now they are making a big
comeback. Seventy-eights or forty-fives or whatever you had at the time. But, in CD
form it was actually a real physical CD.
There were two physical CDs. The first one was right before I went to
Copenhagen and it was just a quick sampler. It was recorded on the fly, overnight, in two
hours. I was like alright, well we did that. I am a believer in everything being
documented, so whatever you can do to have a live recording; those are my favorites
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because that’s real time, real life. But, actually releasing my EP ten, eleven years ago
when I got back from Copenhagen. Five of eight of the tunes are my original tunes in
their infancy. I created also, like the mix tape, this album artwork. I worked with my
friend Nathan Durfee, who was a local artist here. We were both at the start of our
careers. I was really proud of this album because it was the first thing that I had really
created that felt wholly me. Now, I’m excited about what’s next, always. But, I am proud
that there was an output and there was work to it.
DJ: When you go into the studio to do these recordings of all the music that you
are coming up with, what is your approach to going into the studio?
LS: Try to be as prepared as I can be because time is money in the studio
honestly. I think it’s important to go in with people, I’ve learned this the hard way too, to
go in with people who bring you up and make you feel really good. For me, that’s
sometimes more important than how technically proficient the music is. At the end of the
day people are putting this into their lives and if it doesn’t move you whenever you’re
driving down the road, or running, or washing dishes, or whatever you are doing then
what’s the point. For me, I think going into the studio with people who at least have a
vested interest in your project and in you as a person.
They don’t have to love the material, you’re paying them to be there. I don’t love
everything I do all the time either, but at the same time I think that’s important. I think
the respect of the entire experience. Then the music, that’s the gift. That’s the part that it
should make itself at that point. If you have all the right ingredients; the preproduction,
the planning, the arrangements, all of that done so that you can walk in and as an artist
just feel like an artist and create.
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DJ: This is probably going to be a hard question, but what would you say would
be your highest and lowest moments in your musical career?
LS: Oh man. We should have talked at three in the morning this morning. I would
have given you some good ones. I think, honestly, they happen at the same times. I’m
often up at that time in the morning and in fact I didn’t get to sleep until about five and
knew I would have a two hour window and pushed it until I could. Let’s start with the
lowest moment.
They are teaching moments, the moments you learn the most. I think it wasn’t
necessarily a musically low moment for me, except I had to go out on stage after a dear
friend died. Not only was I performing in a show, I was producing the show. I was
responsible for the organization that was putting the show on. I found this person dead
just two weeks before because then we had to do all the funeral arrangements, do the jazz
processional, arrange all the city planning, and all this stuff.
There was something about going on stage, talk about feeling naked, alone, and
dry. It was also very much the highest point of my career because I was just crying
backstage and people never saw the tears because you hit the stage and you just have to
be on. I knew I had some grace in the audience, you never really have grace in the
audience. People are still judgmental. They don’t want to see you cry. They want to see
you cry a little bit, just enough to get a little choked up in the song, but not enough to not
hear the song.
I knew that I had some friends in the audience, but it’s a packed house and I had
to show up and I didn’t want to show up. I was numb in so many ways and very raw in so
many ways. That was a very low moment, but also a very important moment
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professionally because I realized how important it is that no matter what’s going on I
have a job to do. I went out and did it. I broke down and my body completely shut down
after that show because it was everything I had to give. I’ve been yelled at on stage, I’ve
been demeaned on stage. I’ve been called all kinds of things off stage. All those things,
those are also very low moments. But, at this point you move past those, they are very
fleeting. You have to. It used to stay with me.
The highest moment, wow—every moment. I’m just really present. I think I’ve
had a lot of great moments with a lot of great people. For me that’s what it’s about being
in the music, meeting people in the music. I say that all the time with usually the people
that I’m working with, the musicians. Before the gig we’ll huddle a little bit and I’ll say
I’ll meet you in the music, I’ll see you there. I got that from a great friend, Mark
Sterbank, he’s a great saxophonist here and a great person. There’s something really
spiritual about that experience and I think every performance is unique in that way. Sorry
I don’t have anything more profound, like I was playing with Dizzy Gillespie.
I will say that, that was a proud moment. Okay, I’ll give you two because I’m
here too and this thing is still on. None of you have run out yet. One was being the first
headliner for the South Carolina Jazz Festival in its existence in 2006. I came back from
Copenhagen for that performance. That was very special to me to have that experience,
especially in Dizzy Gillespie’s hometown of Cheraw. I’ve never felt like I really
belonged here and I never felt like I really belonged.
I just felt like I was part of the world, that’s a whole other story probably for
another day. But, there was something really defining about that moment of saying I’m
South Carolinian and I’m representing my state whether you like it or not I’m here. The
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other one was playing here last year. I headlined a group, I don't know if any of you were
at that performance, but it was very special. One it was during Women’s History Month, I
was working with Tiffany Silverman and she said do you want to do something bold?
Always, of course.
We did a tribute to women in jazz. The Citadel commissioned me to write a tune,
so I wrote a tune called “City by the Sea” and performed it here. I remember the Citadel
when there were t-shirts that were walking around the city that said “save the males”.
Now, all due respect as a young person living in Charleston who spent a lot of time on
the Citadel campus because that’s where all the soccer fields were and parade fields for
most of the practice fields at the time, that was a defining moment in a young woman’s
life. That was a special moment last year to be able to stand on stage, to be a woman here,
to be a minority to be fair, and to feel like music can bring people together period. We are
all here and that’s progress.
DJ: How would you say your audiences received your music from back in Mexico
and other places you’ve traveled?
LS: I think well, I hope well. They keep hiring me. I haven’t quit yet, again had
you asked me at three-thirty this morning I would have said I’m just done. But, I think
well. I think I’m a bit of a chameleon. Some artists just are who they are when it comes to
I’m not changing for anybody, this is the music I play.
This is what I’m doing and I respect that whole heartedly. I think that’s really
special. I think for me, I really enjoy playing where I am. I like eating where I am. I like
being where I am. If I’m in Charleston and it calls for me to be a little more traditional for
a program then that’s what I’m going to be. If it’s appropriate and it’s what I feel like
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doing that that’s what it’s going to be.
If I’m in Mexico and through in some boleros or some other Latin American
music that moves people because it’s important too for people to have music that moves
them, that they can relate to, that they can understand sometimes. I feel grateful to have
that ability and sometimes that’s a critical point. Sometimes people criticize me for that,
so be it. I have to make a decision as an artist and it’s my artistic freedom to do so.
DJ: Is there a specific vision you want to put out to the audiences with your
music?
LS: Actually, as of late, yes. I think that’s been really important to me. I think the
past fifteen years have been about building my own voice, listening to myself taking in as
much as I can. At some point, just like in your college careers you intake, intake, intake.
You’re reading, reading, reading and studying, studying, studying. Until you get out into
the world really and experience some real life — not that you’re not experiencing that
now, but in a different way and can really see the intersection of all of that book work
and all of that intellectual thinking and all of that mixed with the realities of social issues
and justice, especially in the world we are living in now.
I think it’s the world it’s always been. As I get older and as I grow as an artist,
and as I find my unique voice and get more comfortable in my skin. I feel like a
completely different artist than I did even a year ago, five years ago, ten years ago. So,
my focus now is concentrating on music with a message and sometimes that has to deal
with topics that maybe people don’t necessarily put at the forefront all the time whether
again it has to do with social justice issues, race relations, whatever that means, identity is
very important to me, and also empowering young women and young people. Just young
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people in general, but I think we have a lot of work to do with making sure people can
see themselves in the people that they are mirroring back and influenced by.
I didn’t have many people to look up to in that way. I mentioned to you it was
mostly a male driven kind of mentality and sort of the antithesis. I was going away from
everything I didn’t want to be. I think there is room for that, but I also wonder what
would it have been like to have had some really strong people early on who could have
influenced maybe my voice a little more. I feel like I’m just now able to say things that
maybe fifteen years ago I really wanted to say.
The world has changed as well, like I said you guys aren’t wearing save the males
anymore. I don’t want to see what’s under your t-shirt. But, that’s important and I think
it’s just important to have that language. I’m on the board right now at the College of
Charleston for the Women’s and Gender Studies Program. That didn’t exist when I was
in school. To see people’s lives transformed because they have a language to talk about
not only to stick up for equal pay and really fight for their right to be at the table, but to
just be human.
We’re all in this together. We need each other. So, that’s the direction where I’m
going and of course we could get into more specifics, but a lot of that’s not necessarily
political, but I do think it’s important as an artist to bear witness and to be a voice for
those who don’t have a voice. I was that person for so long so I know how that feels.
DJ: Throughout your life so far, how would you say your personal journey has
shaped your music?
LS: I think we’ve touched on some of that and I appreciate that question too
because I think as an artist it has very much affected who I am. I’ll just be really candid
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with you because talk about being vulnerable and raw and all of those things. I’m a twice
rape survivor. I’m an abuse survivor; physical, mental, and emotional. These things I
didn’t know at the time. I have been through some really traumatic things in my
childhood that shaped me as a person, as a woman, human being, as a daughter, as a
sister, as an aunt now to add, and definitely as an artist and a musician.
Those things have come out when I started writing in Copenhagen. I talked about
that being a place of healing for me. Well, that was very much where I digested a lot of
life that had happened because it was the first time that I could hear that I wasn’t any of
those labels. I wasn’t not enough of one thing or the other, where people saw me who I
was as Leah, not as anything but who they saw right in front of them. I think, for me, it
has been a very personal journey to get back to. One of the reasons I go back to Mexico is
very much for my identity. There was something missing as a young child. My father is
Mexican and my mother is American. It was a very interesting time to live in South
Carolina especially. There wasn’t a culture here. We were very discriminated against. We
were socioeconomically poor, middle class poor, but we didn’t know it.
We kicked a ball and we played music and we were at the beach, but there were
also some very difficult times. Going through Hugo and losing your house. All of those
things. Now that I’m thirty-five and at a place where I am finding okay in five years, who
am I now. What does she have to say? So much of it is so related to that personal
experience, because that’s what makes all of us uniquely who we are.
I can't tell your story. I can't tell your story. I can't tell your story. But, I do firmly
believe that we have this place that I call sacred ground or common ground where it is the
human experience. So, if I can find a way to interject maybe some very deep personal
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experience and maybe someone can relate to that and that can help someone and that
maybe they can hear themselves or see themselves in that then that is worth every bit of
it. It’s transcending that time and space and really giving us an opportunity to grow, or
maybe it’s something that nobody can relate to, but I put it in a way that it can be a more
universal experience.
DJ: I’m going to pass the mic on now.
Riley Franks: Can you discuss with us some of your work with other jazz artists
in Charleston?
LS: Anything specifically?
RF: Just whatever you want to talk about.
LS: My sophomore year of school, my second year of college I returned to the
College of Charleston and they had a relatively new jazz program there. I knew a lot of
the guys kind of peripherally that I had lived in North Carolina my last two years of high
school and had gone to D.C. after that for school, so I was a little bit removed and
honestly had a love/hate relationship with this place. I’m getting to this point where these
people in Charleston are what kept me here and this jazz community, I think just the
music community in general. Jack McCray who is the friend who died before the
performance he was a mentor of mine and had a big impact on me in music. However, we
met when I was six years-old and I didn’t know it at the time because he was covering
my family being here in Charleston for soccer in a roundabout way.
I’ve recently found the article in the past two years because I’m writing a story
about it. He mentions this little girl who is the sister. Fast forward I come back to school,
he starts coming to the jazz program recitals and I didn’t realize it was him. He was also a
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referee and a volunteer, and advocate for the music, he was a writer at the Post and
Courier, but he was also on the soccer field at Ebony City Soccer Club teaching young
kids values through soccer. He’s an incredible man.
People wouldn’t realize that he is a historian. They just kind of sidetracked him as
oh he’s just a copy editor or writer, but he did so much for Charleston and the scene here.
At the time, he was writing at the paper, finishing up his work there as a copy editor.
Let’s see, I think the year was 2000, 2001. The year was 2001 and he is very connected
with the same musicians. We all kind of knew each other through band as well growing
up in the school systems.
I knew Charlton Singleton because he was ten years older than I was, but sort of
the guy at the time, but he wasn’t a jazz player; he was very much a classical player.
That’s what I mean by musicians and I think moving back and kind of getting a different
perspective on all of these musicians and then really learning and understanding the
history, that was the appreciation coming back. So, here we have such a special history
that it attracted, I think, and cultivated a scene here that maybe you feel but I just didn’t
really know until Jack had encouraged that spark. He would write about it, he created
Charleston Jazz Initiative. Started working with Quentin [Baxter], Karen Chandler, but
Quentin was also part of the program at C of C [College of Charleston] and so was my
combo professor and worked with all of those guys.
We were all kind of the same age so it was real weird. I was definitely ten years
younger, but we all hung out. We’d be at the club the night before. The New Moulin
Rouge, many a fun night there or what was then [00:40:55 Meziane/ Mezz?) which used
to be the hotspot. There would be poetry, jazz, all of that. People like Tommy Gill who
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was very young then.
I think everybody was just working. For me, the experience was very
impressionable coming in, also finding my voice in that. Tommy was my teacher. All of
that made such an impact. It was a magical time that unless you were here it’s kind of
impossible to really know. People say that all the time about where they are and the
places they’ve been; unless you were there, but that’s the importance of things like this
and documenting that.
That’s one thing that Jack really cultivated as well is that need for archiving. If
you didn’t document it, it didn’t happen. Period. That’s true. I think we’re finding that it
is impossible to know. What kind of footprints are we leaving for the next generation.
What do you know about the past to be able to inform the future and how are you going
to be a part of that moving forward? Musicians here, I think we are all two degrees of
separation.
What I’ve found though too is that throughout the world we are all about two
degrees of separation. That’s really the jazz family that I find fascinating and beautiful,
but it’s a lot like soccer as well. It’s kind of like anything the military family. You kind of
just at some point you start to find those connections and it’s really beautiful. Facebook
changed everything. But it’s kind of cool to see, I think to have that kind of history in a
place and with people.
I’ve considered moving so many times. It’s still a love/hate relationship with this
place. Creating the organization, creating Jazz Artists of Charleston was very special. It
made it so I came back from Copenhagen. I was either going to go to New York, San
Francisco, Miami, or Mexico City. Jack was pulling me back to Charleston. He’s like
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you’ve got to come back. We’ve got work to do Leah, we’ve got work to do.
Had he not been there doing that I probably would not have ever come back
because I hated to love this place and I loved to hate this place. So much had happened
here, but it’s such a beautiful city that has all these things. It’s like anything. Anything
that is that beautiful has to have something that is so dark. Right? It just does. You learn
that, people included.
There is something really profound about that. Coming back here and creating
something that could give me a reason to stay and to love this place, that’s why that
organization. That’s why I just didn’t stop. These people I love, this place I love, but I
need to create something that can give me what I need here.
RF: What exactly does the jazz organization do?
LS: You’ll have to ask them that question now for what their focus is now. When
we started the mission at the time was to promote, produce, advocate, present; all of the
above. Educate. It wasn’t just for musicians. It was for the community. You’re educating
the community with performances.
We also started the Charleston Jazz Orchestra. We had the Charleston Jazz House
which was meant to be this sort of cultural center where people could congregate and also
be sort of a jazz loft, sort of Harlem Renaissance-esque, but with the Charleston
renaissance because we were experiencing that at the time. We were going through a
recession at the time, that’s a great time to start a nonprofit and a big band. But, we were
successful. That honestly, in history you’ll see that is when most of these big bands were
started. In war times, it was a form of entertainment. That’s where we are now.
I think people want to be entertained, but they also have to work. A lot of it was
�Leah Suarez
20
that wasn’t their full-time job or maybe their hitting the road at the time there was a lot of
segregation. We are still facing that in a lot of ways, how people come together in the
music and what music they like. So, the organization was really meant to be that common
ground. It was a social experiment in a lot of ways. Things like this had existed before,
they had tried and tried, sometimes it’s just the opportunity meeting the timing, meeting
the people, meeting all those things.
Everything is built on what has happened before. It was the right time, the right
place and it was sort of this magic time on the heels of really the next step for the energy
of the Charleston Jazz Initiative which was research based only. It wasn’t meant to be a
presenting organization. J.C. was then meant to step in and really be the face of bringing
the marketing part of Charleston Jazz to the forefront, give it a face. Give it something
that people can relate to. Give them a box office.
Give them people they can talk on the phone with. Give them a program that also
brought attention to South Carolina musicians and composers. That gave musicians a
calendar to post their gigs on; the jazz around town calendar. That was our premise at the
time. It felt like Little Rascals in a lot of moments. But, I think that’s how it always feels.
I don’t know that production ever feels like you’ve got it in the bag, if it does then
somethings not right.
RF: With the jazz community being so dominant in Charleston, would you say a
lot of the artist’s work well together?
LS: Yes. I think we are unique in that way in a lot of ways. Like anything
everybody has preferences on who they work with. I think we have a unique community
here. It’s small. We need each other.
�Leah Suarez
21
Also, you have to get past some of that. You don’t have to like everybody that
you’re working with, but you have to respect them. Or you don’t and you don’t get called
again. I think at the end of the day everybody loves the music and that’s what is
important. Everybody is there for the music. Again, if you can meet in the music, if you
can show up there, then what you do on your time is your time. I think as long as you are
paying people they’ll show up.
RF: My final question, would you say that there is a vision that kind of unifies all
the jazz artists in Charleston?
LS: Wow. One vision? No, I think people just want to play. I think some people
have a deeper calling for the history. I think some people have a deeper calling for new
music. There is a wide genre of jazz. There are so many different sub-genres.
Jazz is such a word I even dare to use that. It’s a music and it’s an American
music. We are defining it, but it’s ever evolving. That’s the beauty of it. I think it’s come
a long way. It’s funny that you say as prominent as it is in Charleston. That just wasn’t
the case for a long time and hasn’t been the case.
We’re at a real nexus of opportunity, I feel like, here. Charleston has seen a boom
because of things like tourist dollars and the CVB, the Visitor’s Bureau that has done a
great job of marketing Charleston. Sometimes it’s exploited. Sometimes music and jazz is
exploited to be expected. That’s what happened in New Orleans. Charleston predates all
of that. As Jack would say, we’ve just been doing it longer.
We share so many common things, the intersection of African, European,
Indigenous; the food, the climate, all of these things. The idea that we are surrounded by
water. This is no accident. But, what New Orleans was better at doing, what they also had
�Leah Suarez
22
the freedom to do, they had places like the French Quarter and Congo Square where they
were able to meet on Sunday’s and come together. They were great at marketing it. There
was a much greater potential for people to have this intersectionality across culture.
We didn’t have that here. So, when you are segregated, which we still very much
are in a lot of ways, socioeconomically, racially. As Malcom X would say, Sunday is the
most segregated day of the week, it’s true. Especially here in our holy city. I think we are
at an interesting time for this place and how the music will sort of shape all of that.
I’m happy to see it at the forefront. I’d like to think that the work that we were
just digging, digging, digging because so much of that is due in large part to Jack
McCray. But, also, I think to the work that we all did. Sort of everybody who is doing it.
If you are a working musician in town you are doing the work.
That’s all anyone can ask of you. You are showing up. If you happen to do more
than that, that’s awesome. That just helps elevate everyone. But, not everyone is called to
do that. Not everyone honestly has that skill set, I’ve learned that the hard way. I would
say oh that makes sense, I would love to just be an artist, but that’s also not me. I’m an
artist and these other things and I’m now okay with that.
RF: I think we’re going to take these last fifteen minutes to open it up to the class.
If anyone has any questions?
LS: I hope that was helpful. Thank you, gentleman.
JT: I actually have one more question that I wanted to ask before we send it off.
Do you have a favorite artist now and is his or her musical style and/or influence on you
similar to a favorite artist that you may have had in your childhood or early in your
musical career?
�Leah Suarez
23
LS: Wow. Yes. One of my favorite artists right now is Etienne Charles. He is a
Trinidadian born trumpet player, conga player, dear friend. He is doing amazing work.
Who he reminds me of is Dizzy Gillespie. So, it’s not surprising that I would call his
name, but he’s such a dynamic band leader and he’s young.
I can name so many people, but I just really appreciate what he is doing to bring
the world together and educate people about these social issues. He just did a project,
he’s done several projects, but from bringing the Afro-Caribbean beat to meet jazz to this
folk music that is very Caribbean based, but also, I think speaks to people here. It’s just
this big education. He’s done it in a way that he is very academic, but he is also super
real. He’ll go out get a grant and then he’ll go to the street.
He’s out there playing and he’s out there talking to the people. He plays
everything. He’s got a photographic memory. I love that he breaks down those barriers
and those walls. He makes it simple. So, put that on your radar, Etienne Charles.
KT: Question’s out there?
Male Voice: You mentioned you played the euphonium when you were younger,
how long did you play that for?
LS: I’d say ten years really at my studying height of my career on the euphonium.
I had gotten a scholarship to George Mason and then I lost my scholarship after I had to
have the surgery on my mouth. I had to put it down. But, I’ve since come back and I sold
it to stay in Copenhagen which was super painful when I came back because I was like
oh my baby. If you know what a euphonium is, it’s a tenor tuba.
It’s a large brass instrument, super feminine, not at all. I really missed it. I got a
valve trombone, an old Conn valve trombone and I enjoy playing that now. I hope one
�Leah Suarez
24
day—I play in tuba Christmas and I’ll borrow a euphonium and that’s fun. But, that used
to be so painful I couldn’t do it.
I think jazz helped me also have a better voice on the euphonium too. Now I feel
way more musical and I think just getting old. You grow into yourself. Oh yeah, now I
know what Rimsky Korsakov is writing there. I can play that line like a mother.
KT: Other questions?
LS: Oh, come on. Come on, we’re friends.
KT: Don’t be shy.
LS: No?
KT: I’ve got a million. Jack was beginning to assert that Charleston had a unique
jazz sound which I couldn’t replicate his argument. But, I am wondering do you think
Charleston has a distinct sound or has had a distinct sound?
LS: That’s a great question and I’ve thought a lot about that as well. I think when
you listen to any language and you hear a dialect of a language it’s a unique dialect. You
hear the Charleston accent when you hear someone. You know when Mayor Joseph P.
Riley is speaking that that boy is from Charleston. But, you also know when Jack was
speaking that that boy is from Charleston and they are little bit different dialects.
Now, I say that because I think Charleston does have unique rhythm. It’s very
much built on the rice culture and sweet grass and the field hollers and all of that. That
that has come way before us. I think that is uniquely in the language and naturally in our
way of life. The way of moving here even though the way people talk, the way people
move, the way people play music; yes.
I don’t know that many musicians today could identify that like unique like you
�Leah Suarez
25
can in New Orleans that again has been very identified because it’s not been written.
Does that make sense? One project that we did was with Porgy and Bess and the
reimagination of that was specifically for that reason. To call on the writing of those
rhythms. Someone like Quentin can give you those rhythms orally, he can give those
rhythms on tape and I’m sure he’s got them written in his way, right?
I think we do have a sound that if we aren’t careful will not survive. I think it is
important that we find that music, that we find that rhythm. Specifically, rhythm. The
scales and the sounds. Those you can trace to other places. They’ve made it up the
Mississippi and up the coast through migration.
But, it is very difficult to contain an indigenous language and keep that
indigenous language indigenous. We find it all over the world. That also relates to music,
very much so because it’s such a folk tradition. It’s oral. You can find recordings online
and you can hear the difference. They are subtle, but you can hear the differences.
Very different tribes were coming from west Africa here and meeting. Then
you’ve still got the indigenous that was here already. That lives in the land. That lives in
the culture. That lives in the air and breathes. It’s going to be difficult for us, I think,
moving forward.
I don’t hear it as much as I’d love to hear it, but isn’t that part of culture, it
evolves. You can also argue things like the Burke High School Marching Band is the
Charleston sound. You better believe it. It has still a swing that no other place has. Ask
someone to put that on paper and it’s almost impossible. It’s like asking me to speak in a
dialect that’s of my father’s tongue, I can't.
I won't ever be able to emulate. I can try to sound like this or that. Whatever those
�Leah Suarez
26
things are, we lose that over time because you are taught to speak in this way. Same thing
in music. Speak jazz in this way, it’s now jazz. It wasn’t ever called that, that’s not the
Charleston sound, what does that mean?
Well, we can say the rhythm, the Charleston. We all know the dance. We kind of,
I feel like, have this story we’ve made and created in a lot of ways that gives us a great
picture of what it should sound like and does sound like. It does in a lot of ways. Those
are roots. That is what you would call sort of the output of the roots, but I think a musical
anthropologist or ethnomusicologist is going to find that it really has to go way back
before that and have to get to the folk music, the indigenous music, and when those
collided and that’s a Charleston sound. What we have today is also a Charleston sound,
it’s just different. Come on.
KT: I’ll keep jumping in. I was thinking of the role you’ve playing participating
in these tribute shows. The way of forging a stronger musical community in Charleston,
which I think those have been tremendously successful, but then also think about the
musician’s response to the Emanuel massacre and the roll that the music community
played. I was wondering if you could say a few things about that, how that came together
and what you see as the impact.
LS: The tribute shows, in the way like you mean tributes to artists?
KT: Yeah, because I think you’ve been a part of some of those?
LS: Oh, definitely. Part of CJO with the Charleston Jazz Orchestra. That was our
way of bringing people into the fold. You’re getting them interested. People know names
like Dizzy Gillespie or names like Motown. So, you are bringing in all these things.
We know Billie Holliday, we know Nina Simone. We know these names. John
�Leah Suarez
27
Coltrane, Billy Strayhorn, Duke Ellington, Count Basie. We can get into that. We realize
that. But, you get them there and then you educate.
You take them a step further. Maybe they didn’t realize the relationship to
Charleston or the [01:03:25] band, or the music they were playing. You take them to the
B side. You really educate people there when you’ve got their captive attention and
you’ve got that captive audience. I think it is important to go past that and beyond that.
But, you’ve got to have that audience first.
Now, when it comes to Mother Emanuel I had just left the organization June 15th,
2015. Mother Emanuel massacre happened June 16th, 2015. That was very personal and
very devastating. Obviously to our city and whole nation. It was very personal as well. I
would visit the church many times and have many conversations with Clementa
[Pinckney], we were working on a series, that was Jack’s church his childhood church,
very important to the community historically.
At this point, I can speak now. We are almost two years later. I am about to
present a piece called Sacred Ground at Circular Church which is in memory and in
tribute to the victims and the survivors and our community of Mother Emanuel. It’s a
song cycle that I’ve written. As an artist, I am calling it Sacred Ground.
It’s my name and bare witness because I do believe in the artist’s role of bearing
witness and the artists role of response and the artists role of healing. But, it’s also a role
of keeping not just the memory alive, but the essence of something alive. Just like we are
talking about these rhythms. If you don’t do it as an artist, no one else is going to do it.
We have a responsibility as artists, I feel, to do that. There have been many tributes and I
feel like there should be many more always to keep that spirit alive.
�Leah Suarez
28
I have been involved in really high harmony right after. I think people didn’t
know what to do; artists didn’t know what to do. Everybody felt really hopeless, really
helpless, really sad. All of those things we feel as human beings. I can only speak
personally.
I have spent a large portion of the last two years away and in between here and
there. I will spend a couple months here, a couple months going to Mexico City. I was in
Germany last year presenting the start of this project, last summer. That’s another thing,
we are living in a world where this is not unique, something like Mother Emanuel in the
way that it affects all of us; globally. It is unique in that it affects a very specific people in
our very specific place that has a very specific role in history.
You can't not say that what’s happening in London or Syria or Turkey, Mexico, or
Brazil, or in China daily is not just as important to what is happening here. I think we
have to find a way to act locally, think globally. I really believe that. It also helps us
understand world. It helps us move in the world in a compassionate way.
As artists, we can do that. We have a unique role in doing that, in bringing people
together. To have an audience full of people who never would have been in the same
room together was really uniquely rewarding for me as a producer and presenter, but as
an artist’s first. That’s me first. To see that and to look out on stage from the stage it’s
such a beautiful vantage point and to see people who it’s not Sunday at high noon.
This is my community, these are my people. It’s important to have your tribe, it’s
also important to get out into the world and take that heart with you out there and take
your experience out there and find a way to bring that experience back where you are. I
hope that answered your question.
�29
Leah Suarez
KT: Thank you so much for joining us.
LS: Thank you. Thank you for your time. It’s my pleasure.
KT: Three AM, huh?
LS: And I’ve got a board meeting right now. That’s a good day. Thank you all so
very much.
End of recording.
Edited ML 08/14/18
�
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Dublin Core
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Oral Histories
Description
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The oral histories in this collection were produced by The Charleston Oral History Program at the Citadel. Founded in 2008, The Charleston Oral History Program at the Citadel seeks to deepen understanding of the Lowcountry’s rich history and culture through the gathering and presentation of recorded memories from area residents.<br /><h3>Search Tips</h3>
Interviews may be browsed by scrolling to the bottom of this page and selecting "View all items".<br /><br />When using the search bar, we recommend putting quotations around your search term, and selecting the Boolean search option, as illustrated here:<br /><p><img src="https://gdurl.com/aYPj" alt="aYPj" /><br /><br />To view interviews of a specific theme, please see the search tips in each series below.</p>
<h3><strong>The Citadel in War and in Peace<br /></strong></h3>
With generous support from the <a href="http://www.schumanities.org/" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer noopener">Humanities Council of South Carolina</a>, The Charleston Oral History Program at the Citadel collected thirty interviews with Citadel alumni regarding their experiences during WWII. Journalist and historian Jack Bass conducted the interviews during the Fall of 2008.They serve as a powerful testament to the veterans' experiences and their critical contributions to the war effort.<br /><br /><em>*To search interviews in this series, use the following terms utilizing the Boolean search option:</em><br /><ul><li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace"</li>
<li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace -- World War II"</li>
<li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace -- Korean War"</li>
<li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace -- Vietnam War"</li>
<li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace -- The Second Gulf War"</li>
<li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace -- The War in Afghanistan"</li>
</ul>
<h3><strong>Working Charleston</strong></h3>
Working Charleston documents the on and off job experiences of the longshoremen and lawyers, the bartenders and carriage drivers, hospital aides and high tech workers who make Charleston among the nation's prime tourist destinations and vital centers of global trade.<br /><br /><em>*To search interviews in this series, use the following terms utilizing the Boolean search option:</em><br /><ul><li>"Working Charleston"</li>
<li>"Charleston City Workers"</li>
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<h3><strong>Charleston and the Long Civil Rights Movement</strong></h3>
<span><span>These interviews explore how community activism continues to shape modern life in the South.<br /><br /><em>*To search interviews in this series, use the following terms utilizing the Boolean search option:</em><br /></span></span>
<ul><li>"Charleston and the Long Civil Rights Movement</li>
<li>"Civil rights movement--South Carolina"</li>
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</ul><a target="_blank" href="https://citadeldigitalarchives.omeka.net/items/show/193" rel="noreferrer noopener"></a>
<h3><strong>Las Voces del Lowcountry</strong></h3>
<span><span>This project is designed to raise the profile of the Hispanic/Latinos who call the Lowcountry home and to promote a rational and humane conversation regarding immigration, education, and employment policies.<br /><br /><em>*To search interviews in this series, use the following terms utilizing the Boolean search option:<br /></em></span></span>
<ul><li>"Las Voces del Lowcountry"</li>
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<h3><strong>Women in World War II</strong></h3>
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Publisher
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Citadel, the Military College of South Carolina
Oral History
A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge.
Interviewer
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Riley K. Franks
Dennis R. Joyner
Jonathan J. Taylor
Interviewee
The person(s) being interviewed
Leah Suárez
Duration
Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.)
1 hour, 9 minutes
Location
The location of the interview
Charleston, South Carolina
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
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Oral History of Leah Suárez, interviewed by Riley K. Franks, Dennis R. Joyner and Jonathan J. Taylor, 6 April, 2017
Subject
The topic of the resource
Women musicians
Musicians--Training of
Description
An account of the resource
Musician and art entrepreneur Leah Suárez was born on August 12, 1981, in Greenwood, South Carolina. She grew up in Charleston with her parents and three brothers and her childhood activities revolved around soccer and music. As far as early musical experiences go, she remembers singing with her mother to the mixed tapes her brother created for her. Suárez's formal musical training started in middle school when she joined the school band and learned to play the euphonium. She received a scholarship to study that instrument at George Mason University College but she dropped out due to health problems. She returned to South Carolina and enrolled at the College of Charleston, where she focused on vocals. At the age of twenty-four, she participated in the Copenhagen Jazz Festival and lived in Europe for six months. Back in Charleston, with the support of her mentor and friend, Jack McCray, she co-founded Jazz Artists of Charleston (JAC), becoming the organization's Executive Director and the co-producer of the Charleston Jazz Orchestra. In the interview, Suárez talks about her life experiences and how the issues affecting her community shaped her voice and art. She reflects about the challenges and rewards of being a musician entrepreneur in Charleston, her work with other Charleston musicians, and the importance of re-connecting with her Latino roots.
Creator
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The Charleston Oral History Program at the Citadel
Source
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Working Charleston
Publisher
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The Citadel Archives & Museum
Date
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2017-04-06
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Materials in The Citadel Archives & Museum Digital Collections are intended for educational and research use. The user assumes all responsibility for identifying and satisfying any claimants of copyright. For more information contact The Citadel Archives & Museum, The Citadel, The Military College of South Carolina, Charleston, South Carolina, 29409.
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application/pdf
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English
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Text
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https://citadeldigitalarchives.omeka.net/items/show/618
Coverage
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Charleston (S.C.)
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PDF Text
Text
—TRANSCRIPT - AISHA KENYETTA
Interviewee: AISHA KENYETTA
Interviewer: MICHAEL RICE, HOLLY RICKET, GABRIEL GRIMSTAD
Interview Date: APRIL 11, 2017
Location: Charleston
Length: 48 min.
GABRIEL GRIMSTAD: Okay, can you tell us your full name and your date of
birth?
AK: Yes. My name is Aisha Frazier, and my birthday is October 2nd, 1980.
GG: Okay. And I have a couple questions about like your personal life, especially
growing up. I want to know like what was life like for you growing up in a small city in
South Carolina, like really small.
AK: A very small city. I grew up in — I graduated with sixty-one people. That's
how small my town is. It's Monetta, South Carolina. I am an only child to a mom who is
a pastor and a father who is a deacon. So, PK, like I said, only child, but my mom is the
oldest of seven. My dad's the baby of seven. So, lots of cousins, lots of family around at
all times. My dad's family is the musical family. My dad's church is the one that I grew
up in. And so, everything pretty much revolved around the family and what we were
going to do after church on Sunday. And everybody either sings or plays an instrument in
our family. So, it was music at all times, even if it was playing records or playing cassette
tapes, yes, you know, music all the time in our family.
GG: What was that like when you were young? You had a mom who was a pastor
and a dad that was a deacon. I mean...
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AK: It didn't really cause any issues, I think, until I became a teenager. And then,
you know, you run into those — you have those moral decisions to make as a teenager.
Do I really want to go with my friends, or am I going to be the good girl and just go
home? And so, that's kind of where it got dicey, but I survived with minimal
punishments. I got a couple of speeding tickets, but other than that, you know, pretty
much survived unscathed.
GG: Okay. And we saw we were looking into you that you went to Erskine
College...
AK: I did.
GG: ...and then to Southern Wesleyan?
AK: Yes.
GG: Did you always like — did you have other aspirations besides being a
singer?
AK: I've always been interested in a bunch of different things. My BA is in
athletic training, and I love sports, love being able to help people, and my ultimate goal
was to actually become a funeral-services director. I haven't gotten there yet. Every time I
get my classes started, something comes up where I can't finish. But that was my ultimate
goal, and I got the athletic training degree to get myself into the medical services and
then I would move to the next level and move to the next level.
But singing has always been just I wouldn't say a hobby. It's always been there.
So, it was never something I looked at as a career. It's just always been there. So, when I
thought of having a career, I didn't think of music as a career, because it was always
there.
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GG: Right. So, do you see yourself one day actually being able to take those
classes?
AK: Yeah, one day, hopefully.
GG: You're still pretty young, so.
AK: Yeah. One day, hopefully, I'll be able to—you know, I've been able to
apprentice at funeral homes, and so I've gotten a lot of the practical work in. Still
something that I want to do. I just haven't gotten the classes under my belt to be certified
and have that piece of paper to say I can do it.
GG: So, what's life like balancing your career, like your work life and your
personal life? Being a singer, you know, you're probably constantly on the go.
AK: Yes.
GG: Is it difficult?
AK: Very. I have a seven-month-old and a twenty-month-old. And so, and my
husband is currently deployed. I have a day job. I work for Bank of America, fifteen
years now, and it's difficult. Every day is planned to the hour. I have something to do
every hour of every day, and I've never been very organized. I am uber-organized now.
(laughs)
HR: Yeah, I bet so! Two little ones.
GG: I feel like you probably have to be.
AK: Yes, yes. My mother-in-law is amazing. My village is amazing. So, that's
really the only way I can do what I do. That, and coffee.
GG: So, you mentioned that you want to one day be a funeral-services director. Is
that what you imagine your life after, you know, a singing career being?
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AK: Yeah.
GG: Is there a life after the singing career? Do you want to always do that?
AK: I think it's just going to be something that's always there. You know, being
able to sing is something that I, you know — being able to perform, I guess I should say,
is just that's what I really enjoy. Being on stage, being able to connect to people, being
able to make people happy or to even to show appreciation, you know, whether it's to
sing for somebody's wedding ceremony or even to sing if somebody requests you to sing
at a family member's funeral. I mean, for people to entrust you with their special
moments is a big deal, whether you're getting paid to do it or not. So, if I can carry a tune
at ninety-three years old, then I plan to still be able to do it.
GG: Right. That's like a skill set that doesn't really go away.
AK: Exactly.
HOLLY RICKET: So, I want to go back to the beginning, and there's something
that we read, talked about you were in the choir. And he'll talk and ask you more
questions about that. But how did you get started in the choir, like at church? Was this the
church that your mom is a pastor at?
AK: Yes.
HR: Okay.
AK: She wasn't the pastor then. It's because it's, like I said, it's my dad's church,
actually. But we just, you know, it's a family church. Everybody is connected somehow
by blood and just everybody is a singer and the choir would sing on Sundays and I'd want
to be with my cousin on the choir. And so, I would sit with them and just started singing
with them. And somebody gave me a little plastic play microphone and I would carry it
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around all the time and sing.
HR: So, you were in the choir even when you were little.
AK: Even when I was little.
HR: And you were in choir until...
AK: Until I left to go to Erskine, so until '98.
HR: So, when did you transition out of gospel music, or is that still what you
sing?
AK: I still, yeah. I still, I'm Worship Leader at Seacoast North Charleston.
HR: Okay. I go there sometimes. It's a good church.
AK: Yeah. So, I still — I've never transitioned out of gospel. My mom is happy to
hear that.
HR: Yes!
AK: You know, I don't think it's something that you can get away from, just
because when you're singing gospel, you're not just performing. You know, you're
worshiping. You're creating an experience for others to worship. And so, it becomes
more than just a performance. So, I don't think I'll ever stop singing gospel.
HR: But what other kind of music do you also sing? I know I read somewhere that
you've done covers for bands like Guns N' Roses.
AK: I'm a huge GNR fan!
HR: So, how did you get into that area, and were your family supportive of that?
AK: Yes. I... in our household, there was nothing that was considered the music
we don't listen to. I mean, we listened to everything. My parents have always been avid
music lovers, and, you know, we had the records that we would play on Saturday
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morning while we were cleaning the house. And everything. My dad had Black Sabbath
records and, you know, we listened.
We listened to everything, and my parents always made sure that I knew that I
don't have to just listen to what's considered music for black people, you know. I could
listen to whatever I wanted to listen to, and I gravitated to... 80s hair bands and classic
rock. That's kind of where — and funk. So, which that made my daddy happy, because
he's a huge Parliament-Funkadelic fan. And so, that's kind of where I landed. Chaka Khan
is my — she's my one. She's my idol. If she were to walk in this room right now, you'd
have to give me smelling salts. And so, the funk and 80s rock, classic rock, that's what I
love. So, give me some Bad Company, GNR, and Chaka Khan, and I'm good.
HR: So, you went from gospel music and you still do it and then you started doing
covers. So, when did you transition, or have you, to your own music, writing your own
music?
AK: I am writing a lot. I've been a little bit hesitant to show what I've written, and
one of my friends is working with me on that, because always in the beginning, I would
only write if I felt negative emotions. I never really wrote because I was happy to be here.
It was always, you know, I'm furious and I'd write things down. And so, now I'm getting
to the point where I can put things on paper that aren't emotionally charged. I can put
things down. You know, I woke up this morning. It was pretty outside, and it made me
think of something to write down. I have not put that on record anywhere.
HR: Have you ever sung any of your own music?
AK: Yes, I have.
HR: Where?
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AK: Not out in public.
HR: Oh! Do you think you'll get there?
AK: I have for friends. Maybe at some point. It's very... it exposes you. It really
— it exposes you in a way that's really... even if it's not necessarily something that you
are revealing, it's like you're putting yourself out there, you know, for other people to
hear and other people to see. And so, for me, I think it's just going to be, at what point am
I okay with that exposure? And I'm not there yet.
HR: Yeah. So, then, how did you get introduced to the band AmpSquared?
AK: AmpSquared, yeah.
HR: How did that come about?
AK: So, AmpSquared is me and my friend Rodrick Simmons. Rodrick is actually
the music director at Seacoast North Charleston. And Rodrick and I used to sing with
Secrets together a while back. And when I left Secrets, Rodrick left Secrets, and we
decided to collaborate. And what we really wanted to do was just amp up, you know, the
cover scene. You know, everybody does covers, and they sound just like the record, or
they, you know. But what we wanted to do is just funk everything, I mean, just even...
everything that you think you're going to hear, turn it on its ear. And he was ready for
that.
We wanted a full band with horns and musical stylings and just, you know, really
taking it up a notch. And so, we decided to work together. And now we're neighbors in
real life. And so, we get to really, you know, we are a for-real garage band right now,
because we're — .
HR: Are you looking for any of this to ever get published?
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AK: Yes.
HR: Or is it already in some way, like published? Is it on the radio?
AK: We have some things that are. We have some Christmas singles out, but we
haven't done anything beyond that. Now, Rodrick has. Rodrick works and he writes for
gospel artists all over and he's toured with D'Angelo. He's toured with Joss Stone, people
like that. And so, now he's basically, I think I'm his pet project, pretty much, but, you
know, at some point, you know, I'll have some things out there. But, again, it becomes
how much of yourself are you ready to put out there?
HR: Right. So, do you do like gigs around Charleston?
AK: I do.
HR: And how do you market yourself for those?
AK: I really am more of a freelance performer. I work with just about every band
around. I do a lot with Emerald Empire, which is a collective of musicians here. We do a
lot of weddings. We do corporate events, things like that. And then, I work with Super
Deluxe. I work with Plane Jane. I work with pretty much whoever is out there that would
like to sing with me. And I stay busy.
HR: But then another question I was really interested in, your husband. So, I read
somewhere that you guys were recently married...
AK: 2014.
HR: ...with the two kids. So, does your husband share that musical interest with
you, or does he support what you do?
AK: He loves it. He won't sing. He can sing, but he won't sing. And he, you know,
he supports me, and if it's — even if it's staying at home with the boys so I can do a
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last—minute show, you know, he's supporting. Or if we get that one night where my
mother-in-law decided to take them, you know, he'll come with me to my show or he'll
come pick me up or drop me off and things like that. So, he's very supportive.
HR: That's awesome.
MICHAEL RICE: So, we know that you transitioned kind of from out of gospel
into more of the R&B and 80s music. But I want to ask you, of all of the genres that you
have sung, what is your favorite, if you have one?
AK: 80s. 80s, rock. 80s rock, 80s pop. Universally, everybody likes it. So, from a
performance standpoint, if you sing Whitney Houston "I Wanna Dance with Somebody"
or if you sing Bon Jovi's "Livin' on a Prayer," everybody in the room is going to sing
along with you. And to me, that's where I'm having the most fun, when I can be out and
in the crowd and enjoying the crowd and, you know, holding my microphone out for
somebody to say, "Whoa!" You know. So, from a performance standpoint, I would say
just 80s pop, 80s rock. From a personal standpoint, my favorite to sing is the funk. Give
me the funk.
MR: So, when you're doing cover art, when you're a cover artist, a lot of times,
you have to sing these extremely difficult songs, like you mentioned Whitney Houston.
Someone who sings one of her songs, they have to be really prepared for it. But every
now and again, you may get someone who you think can kind of hold a torch to Whitney.
Have you ever gotten that reaction from a crowd where they say, "Wait a minute. Who's
Whitney?"
AK: Yes. There are certain — there are certain songs that... you've got to be very
bold to try. There are certain Whitney songs that I think are safe. You know, "Dance with
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Somebody" is still not easy to sing but one of her safer songs to sing. You know,
everybody is not going to try "I Will Always Love You," you know. I do "Don't Stop
Believing." There are a lot of artists and Charleston that won't do it. I'm either crazy, or
— but I can do it. That's probably the one that when I start singing it, people are like, "Is
she really going to do this? Is she going to do it?" And they kind of look and wait and
then when you hit the note, they're like, "She did it." (laughs)
MR: Have you ever really participated in like talent shows? A lot of people get
their fame from talent shows. Have you ever been a part of those?
AK: When I was younger, I would, you know, be in talent shows. Now, not so
much, just because I sing all the time, you know. Even karaoke. When I go to karaoke, I
will purposely pick something I've never sung before, because, I mean, I can sing
"Uptown Funk" in my sleep. I can sing "At Last" in my sleep. There are certain songs
that... that really and truly, if you're a performer and you go to karaoke, it's not fair, for
the others. And it's not about performing. It's about having fun. So, you know, I'm not
going to karaoke to try to show you how well I can sing. So, I always try to keep that in
mind when I do stuff like that.
I don't — very rarely will I do a talent show, unless it was just strictly this is
Aisha and she's a singer. She's going to sing you a song. Now, if it's a competition, I
won't do it.
MR: So, you mentioned you are kind of transitioning into making your own
music, writing your own music. You also mentioned that Chaka Khan was one of your
idols. So, do you kind of see yourself in her, and are you modeling your music off of
hers?
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AK: I definitely. I can definitely see the parallels in how I write, though I even,
even the way I sing, from a covers standpoint, she's always — I'm very percussionfocused. I'm more of, I will always tell people, I am not a finesse singer. I'm a power
singer. So, you know, if there's a note that I need to hit, I can hit it. But I'm not going to
give you thirty-two notes in five seconds. That's not me. And that's not Chaka. But when
I sing, my diction is rhythmic. My voice is an extension of the percussion instruments.
It's not — I'm not the violin. I'm the bass. You know.
MR: So, as a singer, a lot of times, when you're a very well singer, you get
everyone asking you, saying if you decide to go to church on a random Sunday, someone
will say, "Oh, well, come up here and sing this selection." I see that. I've seen that a lot.
Have you ever reached that point where you're just like, I don't want to sing this week;
just give me a break?
AK: There have been times where I didn't go places, because I knew that if I got
there, they would ask me to sing. And I'm not proud of that. (laughs) But, you know,
sometimes you do want to just sit in the audience. However, I know that I've been given a
gift, and for the most part, I try to, you know, honor that in any way I can. Every time I
step foot in church, I always have one in my pocket, because you might have to sing. So,
instead of going, oh, my God, oh, my God, oh, my God, what am I going to sing, I have
one in my pocket when I pull up in the parking lot.
MR: That's great.
HR: That's smart. You're always ready.
MR: So, I believe we've all heard your voice. We've done our research. And you
mentioned that you want to have a career in funeral services. So, what will it take for you
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to kind of branch off and go straight in your career in music, because I think we all can
agree that it's worth it.
AK: You know, I don't know. Everybody asks me that question. You know,
"What is it going to take for you to say 'I'm going to be a full-time performer'?" And, you
know, I don't know what it is. I feel like if it happens, then it happens. I'm probably not
going to do anything to purposefully make it happen. I'm content with I'm blessed to be
able to work as much as I work, and at the moment, that's enough for me. That's enough
for me. You know, at some point, I'll put some music out there. Do I need to be a,
quote/unquote, "successful performer"? I feel like I am. I'm successful. I'm successful,
based on what I wanted to do as a singer.
Would I like to have a platinum single or a platinum album? That would be
awesome. But then, on the flip side of that, can I take my babies on tour? You know. And
Mommy is much more important than performer for me at the moment. So, and I'm kind
of out of that window of cutesy pop singer. You know, I'm past that age. So, (laughs) I
have to... you know, I think about, from a marketing standpoint, you know, how they
market singers, how they market performers, especially women. I'm thirty-six. You
know, I'm kind of outside of that, you know. (laughs)
MR: It's never too late. It's never too late.
GABRIEL GRIMSTAD: Okay, yeah, going back on your music tastes, like what
you like, I'm a huge fan of 80s rock. So, I want to know, like what's your favorite band?
AK: Guns N' Roses.
GG: Guns N' Roses. That's it, huh?
AK: Guns N' Roses is my favorite 80s rock band. But then, of course, I love
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Poison and I love Toto and I, you know… Gosh, I don't — I mean, I could go on.
GG: Yeah. It's a long list, I'm sure.
AK: Yes. Bon Jovi.
GG: Like Bad Company, you said.
AK: Bad Company.
GG: Great music.
AK: I just, there's so much energy in it, you know. It's hair-flipping music, even if
you don't have hair. You know, you want to just, you know. So, it's just it's an instant
party the minute you put on something in the 80s, in that 80s realm.
GG: Right. So, going back on some of the earlier music that you wrote, you said it
was kind of really personal and everything. Why do you feel like you didn't put it out
there? Did you just feel like you weren't ready to, you weren't ready to do it?
AK: Yeah, just I wasn't ready to present myself in that light, just because, you
know, I've gone through some things and my first husband was in Iraq twice, came home
PTSD, lots of issues, and I wrote a lot during that time. And so, I wrote it to get it out.
And now, when I look back and read it or I look back and hear the things that I've
recorded, I mean, literally just on a tape recorder, it's something — like it literally makes
my heart ache to hear. And I don't know if I could put that out to the world to feel or to
hear, you know, how I felt at that time.
And I think it's just which — I've been told that that's what you want to put out, is
that heart-wrenching stuff, because it's real and you can feel.
HR: And other people can relate to it, especially other people in situations you've
been in.
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AK: Right. And so, it just boils down to me saying, okay, let's put it out there.
And it's just, you know, it's you feel, you know, like you're the only person naked in the
room, basically.
GG: Yeah, I know that a lot of my favorite musicians, they have like transitions in
their musical career where you can clearly see like different emotions in their musical
styling. It's like some of their earlier stuff will be like dark and really deep and then it
starts to get like more upbeat as they go along and they're at like different phases. Do you
feel like — .
AK: Oh, yes.
GG: Do you feel like your music has done the same thing, the stuff that you
write?
AK: Oh, yes. Just even just flipping, everything is in the same book. I've got one
big binder, and I just add pages to it. And everything, it's actually backwards, so the first
page is the most recent stuff, and then as you flip through, it gets darker, because the
original things were dark. And then as, you know, you move through and you survive a
difficult relationship—I'll just put it that way—you know, and then you find love again
and then, you know, you go through losses and then you adopt a baby and then you find
out you're going to have a baby and then, you know, all these things. And so, now
everything is about being a mom. Everything is about Mommy and, you know, loving,
being a parent and, you know, looking at these little faces, whereas before, it was, you
know, eee, eee, eee. So.
GG: Well, that's got to be pretty neat, though. I mean, it's like heart-wrenching,
some of your older music, but at the same time, you have like a very detailed account of
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like your life.
AK: Yes.
GG: And it, you know, whether you want to go back or not, it's something that I
feel like a lot of people, you know.
AK: It's the ultimate diary. It really is. It's going to be an amazing gift to someone
someday. I don't know that I would want my children to read it all, but maybe when they
are thirty-six, they could handle it. But I definitely wouldn't want my children to read
everything in that book at sixteen or seventeen years old.
HR: So, I have a question. Do you have like a worst experience onstage or like
something that went wrong onstage ever? I'm just curious.
AK: I've had two bad experiences. We did a wedding at—I probably shouldn't
name the venue. But it was so—they were so concerned about the decibels. There was a
person walking around with the meter to check the decibels of the sound. We were
outside. And it's really hard to sing "Crazy in Love" softly. So, after every song, you
know, and they would come over and "You're too loud. You're too loud." And I mean, we
really, everything was pianissimo. I mean, there was no way you could raise your voice. I
mean, so, that was difficult.
And then, I did a wedding one time and I got there and I completely lost my
voice. I couldn't sing. I couldn't. I could barely talk. Later, well, the next day, I found out
I had bronchitis and something else. I can't remember. So, for two-and-a-half hours, I was
—I had to talk my way through every song, which by the end, I sounded like I was
barking by the end of the night. But had to do it, and the people were like, "Oh, you were
great." And I'm crying and, "This is the worst night ever."
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We've had malfunctions where the speakers didn't work or a speaker blew at a
show one time. We've had drunk people fall into the drums or fall into you or pull you
down or pour drinks or upchuck on you. I mean, people get touchy-feely with the band.
They, you know, they think you're their best friend, and, I mean, you want them to think
that you're here for just them. But sometimes, the boundaries get crossed, and those are
difficult nights.
HR: So, then, do you have like a most memorable experience, going on the other
side of the spectrum?
AK: Mm… I mean, they're all. There are nights where the show was so much fun
and you're so high going home, I ride home in silence, because nothing on the radio,
nothing on my iTunes can compare to how I felt and how I feel driving home and I'm
replaying it in my head. And you get home and you shower and you lay down in the bed
and you're still just like... like, oh, and when we did that, that was so hot! I have those
nights probably twice a week.
HR: Oh, that's awesome.
AK: So, you know, it's — I couldn't put one on top. I couldn't put one on top.
HR: That's still a pretty good feeling to have. So, backtracking, when did you
have your first solo? If you went from being in a gospel choir, when was that first
experience of a solo?
AK: My first solo was at church. It was. (laughs) And it wasn't supposed to be
mine. It was the girl who was supposed to be singing the song forgot the words, and I was
maybe five or six. And she forgot the words. She started crying. And I picked it up and I
just started singing. And so, I guess you would consider that my first. And so, she's
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standing there, (crying sound) and I'm singing the song. And from that point on, I started
singing. Even in the choir, we did. We had a mass choir, and, I mean, as big as my area
is, a mass choir, you know, isn't huge. But, you know, we had a choir of thirty singers,
and I could do, you know, I would sing lead a lot. And so, I would say probably from that
five-year-old point to going to now.
HR: Wow. And in all this time of musical background, did you ever learn to play
an instrument?
AK: I play piano.
HR: Okay.
AK: Yeah. I play piano.
HR: What made you pick the piano up?
AK: It was the one that I could already do it. I started playing at church by ear,
and then my mom said, "If you're going to play it, you're going to play it for real." And
so, she put me in lessons. So, that's where I learned how to read music. And I played at
our home church until I graduated high school, and then when I went to Erskine, I played
for a church in Greenwood until I graduated college. So, that was my extra money. And I
played. And then after that, I was like I want to sing. I don't want to play anymore.
HR: So, you don't play the piano anymore?
AK: I can. I just don't. (laughs) I'll play if I'm at home, if I'm writing, or if I'm
learning a song, I'll play it to myself to learn it. And every now and then, I've had to play
at church if Roger couldn't make it or a special occasion and they wanted a bigger band,
I'll play. I play as needed. So, but I always say I'd rather sing than play. And, you know,
it's served its purpose.
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MR: When you were a child, you mentioned how you got started, how you
wanted to be on a gospel choir with your older cousins. Do you kind of see in the future
your children having that same kind of dream to want to be on a choir or onstage with
their mom?
AK: I think so. Tyree, who is my big boy, Tyree is the one we've adopted and he's
twenty months old and he's drawn to the instruments. Most kids all, they all go to the
drums. Tyree likes guitars and pianos. So, when he plays my keyboard at home and he'll
play it and dance around and Joe is seven months old and, you know, Joe performed with
me until I was eight months pregnant. (laughs) So, Joe is onstage for every high note and
for, you know, every song I danced around to. And you can tell he's the singer.
He, when I do Motown out at The Pour House, always sits — that's one of the few
venues that's kid-friendly on a Sunday afternoon. And so, you know, my mother-in-law
or my husband will bring them out, and they can see me onstage. And Tyree is amazed at
the guitar player. He doesn't care about what Mommy is doing. But Joseph is always
watching me. And anytime there's—I find it telling that if you want Joseph to sit still,
which at seven months is, you know, almost impossible, put Whitney Houston videos on.
He will sit and he will watch. He won't make a peep.
MR: That should quiet anybody up.
AK: (laughs) Yes. So, I'm thinking I'm pretty sure Joe is a singer.
MR: So, you mentioned you were actually pregnant while you were onstage. Was
that difficult for you to be able to perform?
AK: I was fine up until about, I would say, about the fifth month. As it got hot
and doing weddings outside, it started to be a little bit more difficult. And then as my
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belly got bigger, I lost some of my stamina for, you know, to hold a long note or even to
hit a high note, because my diaphragm got scrunched together.
So, and we did a Sly & the Family Stone tribute show at The Pour House and I
put it on the calendar as my last performance. And about two weeks before that, I thought
to myself, mm, I thought I was going to be able to make it, but I don't think I can make it.
But ended up doing that, and I even did the national anthem at the River Dogs at nine
months pregnant. That was—I prayed a lot right before I walked out there, because I was,
you know, I handled my pregnancy well, you know, so I wasn't waddling too bad, but
just, you know, "rocket's red glare" is crucial. And — .
HR: Yes, it is!
AK: And you know, "rocket's red glare," and I was just like, "Come on, baby, stay
low, stay low, baby, stay low." And that was, you know, that was the hardest part, was
just getting the air in to push out. So, that was the hardest part about performing while
pregnant and just getting tired. I got tired super-fast. So, there was always a stool or a
chair close by that I could sit on always.
MR: Has your voice changed at all over the years?
AK: Yeah.
MR: It seems like you've been singing a lot.
AK: Yeah. I didn't realize that it had changed, because, you know, I hear it all the
time. So, I will say, but when I go home and sing at home, especially when I sing at
church at home, my daddy will say, you know, "You know, you can sing." And I'm like,
"Well, I couldn't sing before?" And he says, "Well, yeah, but it's different now." And I
think confidence is one thing that makes a big difference. And also, you know your body.
�Aisha Kenyetta
20
You know your voice. You know what you can do. You know what you can't do.
And I am a firm believer in staying in your lane as a singer. Everybody can't sing
everything. There are songs out there that I'd love to do. Beyoncé's "Love On Top," it's
not in my lane, so I don't do it. Beyoncé's "Crazy in Love," in my lane, I can do it. I'm not
going to try to do a song that's not in my lane, because it's going to end up bad. It's not
going to end well, you know.
You know your voice and you know what you can do. If you need to take it down
a key, take it down a key. If you need to take it up a key, take it up a key. You know what
the top of your range is, and when you strain past that, that's when you lose your voice or
you have a sore throat or you're hoarse the next day. But if you're in a range that's
comfortable for you, you can, you know, you can do whatever. And so, you learn how to
work within your range.
And that's, I think that's what I've... what has changed about my voice is that I
know what I can do. And so, I keep myself in what I can do instead of trying to do what
she can do, because she may be a great singer. We don't—we're not going to sound alike.
And I can't be Chaka Khan, you know, because she's Chaka Khan. I can be Aisha, and
Chaka Khan can be my idol. She can be my role model. But I'm not Chaka Khan. And so,
I can't. If I try to sing just like her, then I'm not being authentic to myself, even if I'm
singing her song. I still have to sing it like Aisha.
HR: So, having this range, performing at weddings, do they request specific
music from you when you're—and is that anytime like out of your range?
AK: There are — most weddings, there's always maybe at least one song that I
may have to learn for usually first dances. They may want something. But the good thing
�Aisha Kenyetta
21
is that I can—I pretty much sing every genre. And the only song—there is a song that
someone asked for me to sing, and it wasn't necessarily that I couldn't sing it. I just didn't
like the song. And it was a mother-son song, and it was cheesy. It was a cheesy song. But
for the most part, there's I can learn it. I will learn up to three songs for a wedding. But,
you know, I shouldn't have to learn a whole set list for your wedding.
So, I say, "These are the songs that I can do, you know, and then let me know
what genres you want at your ceremony." Or what don't you want to hear is the first thing
I ask. "What don't you want to hear?" Some people may say, "No country," or they may
say, "No Electric Slide." And I'm completely here for that, you know? No line dances or,
you know, they may say—I had a wedding one time where they said they didn't want any
Michael Jackson.
INT: That's not fair!
AK: And I thought to myself, "Well, that's my whole set list!" So, you know, it
just depends on what they want. I've done weddings where all they want is old-school
Motown or all they want is 80s rock or all they want is 90s R&B. So, you know, being a
wedding singer, you have to be willing to sing, and you sing the same songs every week,
because everybody wants the same thing.
So, you know, like I said, "Uptown Funk," you know, you sing it every week.
"Respect," you sing it every week. "At Last," "Don't Stop Believing." There are certain
songs that you are going to sing at every single wedding. And then you have those oneoffs, and they want Bell Biv DeVoe and, you know, I'm ready, you know, ready.
GG: How long does it take for you to get ready for something like that?
AK: Not too long. There are very few songs that I'm not at least familiar with.
�Aisha Kenyetta
22
And just performing as often as we do and doing as many weddings and things as we do,
your set list grows, because as you learn a song for this wedding, it goes into your set list,
because somebody else might want to hear it later. So, I mean, if I've got to learn one or
two songs, it may take me a week, and then we'll run it before the ceremony or before the
dances and then do it.
HR: So, how often do you guys get together and practice or prepare?
AK: We don't.
HR: So, if you have an event coming up on, say, this Saturday, when would you
prepare for it?
AK: I would prepare myself this week.
HR: But as a group?
AK: As a group, we would get there early enough to run it before the guests are
there. Very rarely do we actually get together and rehearse. But we all play together all
the time, so we know each other's nuances, you know. So, you can—it really is a
familiarity when you're singing with people that you perform with all the time.
Everybody—you know when I'm going to vamp out. You know when I'm going to go
back to—and everybody's got their own hand signals and, you know, you know what that
means when you're playing with different people. And that helps.
From a preparedness standpoint, you don't have to rehearse, because they know
you're going to be there and you're going to be ready to sing it. In situations like that, you
don't veer from the original. So, if it's something that you've got to learn to perform, you
sing it just like the original so that there are no errors. They learn it like the original, and
you learn it like the original, so when you get together, there's no issues.
�23
Aisha Kenyetta
INT: Interesting.
GG: So, it's a lot like a family, like you were saying. You all really do know each
other very well.
AK: Yes.
GG: Okay. That probably makes everything a lot easier, I would think.
AK: It does. It does.
INT: Okay, anything else?
MR: It may not be too professional of me, but I wouldn't mind to hear a little bit
in person, if you wouldn't mind.
AK: Okay. I didn't come here with one in my pocket.
GG: Caught you off guard.
AK: You did! Well, like I said, she's my idol. So, Chaka Khan.
[Sings] "Through the fire, to the limit, to the wall, for a chance to be with you, I'd
gladly risk it all. Through the fire, through whatever, come what may, for a chance at
loving you, I'd take it all the way, right down to the wire, even through the fire."
MR: Oh, yeah.
INT: That's good! That is really good.
INT: I just sing in the shower. So...
INT: That was amazing.
AK: That's early-morning voice.
GG: That puts me to shame. All right, well, thank you so much for being here
with us today. It was great to have you.
End of recording.
�24
Aisha Kenyetta
Edited by ML 8/15/18
�
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Dublin Core
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Oral Histories
Description
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The oral histories in this collection were produced by The Charleston Oral History Program at the Citadel. Founded in 2008, The Charleston Oral History Program at the Citadel seeks to deepen understanding of the Lowcountry’s rich history and culture through the gathering and presentation of recorded memories from area residents.<br /><h3>Search Tips</h3>
Interviews may be browsed by scrolling to the bottom of this page and selecting "View all items".<br /><br />When using the search bar, we recommend putting quotations around your search term, and selecting the Boolean search option, as illustrated here:<br /><p><img src="https://gdurl.com/aYPj" alt="aYPj" /><br /><br />To view interviews of a specific theme, please see the search tips in each series below.</p>
<h3><strong>The Citadel in War and in Peace<br /></strong></h3>
With generous support from the <a href="http://www.schumanities.org/" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer noopener">Humanities Council of South Carolina</a>, The Charleston Oral History Program at the Citadel collected thirty interviews with Citadel alumni regarding their experiences during WWII. Journalist and historian Jack Bass conducted the interviews during the Fall of 2008.They serve as a powerful testament to the veterans' experiences and their critical contributions to the war effort.<br /><br /><em>*To search interviews in this series, use the following terms utilizing the Boolean search option:</em><br /><ul><li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace"</li>
<li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace -- World War II"</li>
<li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace -- Korean War"</li>
<li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace -- Vietnam War"</li>
<li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace -- The Second Gulf War"</li>
<li>"The Citadel in War and in Peace -- The War in Afghanistan"</li>
</ul>
<h3><strong>Working Charleston</strong></h3>
Working Charleston documents the on and off job experiences of the longshoremen and lawyers, the bartenders and carriage drivers, hospital aides and high tech workers who make Charleston among the nation's prime tourist destinations and vital centers of global trade.<br /><br /><em>*To search interviews in this series, use the following terms utilizing the Boolean search option:</em><br /><ul><li>"Working Charleston"</li>
<li>"Charleston City Workers"</li>
<li>"Lowcountry Foodways"</li>
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<h3><strong>Charleston and the Long Civil Rights Movement</strong></h3>
<span><span>These interviews explore how community activism continues to shape modern life in the South.<br /><br /><em>*To search interviews in this series, use the following terms utilizing the Boolean search option:</em><br /></span></span>
<ul><li>"Charleston and the Long Civil Rights Movement</li>
<li>"Civil rights movement--South Carolina"</li>
<li>"African Americans--Civil Rights--South Carolina--Charleston"</li>
</ul><a target="_blank" href="https://citadeldigitalarchives.omeka.net/items/show/193" rel="noreferrer noopener"></a>
<h3><strong>Las Voces del Lowcountry</strong></h3>
<span><span>This project is designed to raise the profile of the Hispanic/Latinos who call the Lowcountry home and to promote a rational and humane conversation regarding immigration, education, and employment policies.<br /><br /><em>*To search interviews in this series, use the following terms utilizing the Boolean search option:<br /></em></span></span>
<ul><li>"Las Voces del Lowcountry"</li>
<li>"Latin Americans--Southern States"</li>
<li>"Hispanic Americans--Southern States"</li>
</ul>
<h3><strong>Women in World War II</strong></h3>
<em>*To search this series, type "Women in World War II" into the search bar, using the Boolean search option.<br /></em>
<ul><li>"Women in World War II"</li>
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</ul>
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
Citadel, the Military College of South Carolina
Oral History
A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge.
Interviewer
The person(s) performing the interview
Gabriel T. Grimstad
Michael L. Rice
Holly L. Rickett
Interviewee
The person(s) being interviewed
Aisha Kenyetta
Duration
Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.)
48 minutes
Location
The location of the interview
Charleston, South Carolina
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Oral History of Aisha Kenyetta, interviewed by Gabriel T. Grimstad, Michael L. Rice and Holly L. Rickett, 11 April, 2017
Subject
The topic of the resource
African American musicians
African American musicians--South Carolina
Women musicians
Description
An account of the resource
Vocalist Aisha Kenyetta (a.k.a Aisha Frazier) was born in 1980, in Monetta, South Carolina. Before going to college, her life revolved around family and church activities. Kenyetta describes herself as a freelance vocalist with a powerful voice: “ I'm a power singer... but when I sing, my diction is rhythmic. My voice is an extension of the percussion instruments. It's not—I'm not the violin. I'm the bass.” She performs with her own band, AmpSquared, and several others such as Super Deluxe, Plane Jane, and the musician collective Emerald Empire. Additionally, she is the North Charleston Seacoast Church's Worship Leader. In the interview, Kenyetta discusses balancing family, her day work, and music career and states she is grateful for the many opportunities to perform. At the time of the interview, Kenyetta was writing her own material.
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
The Charleston Oral History Program at the Citadel
Source
A related resource from which the described resource is derived
Working Charleston
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
The Citadel Archives & Museum
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2017-04-11
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
Materials in The Citadel Archives & Museum Digital Collections are intended for educational and research use. The user assumes all responsibility for identifying and satisfying any claimants of copyright. For more information contact The Citadel Archives & Museum, The Citadel, The Military College of South Carolina, Charleston, South Carolina, 29409.
Format
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application/pdf
Language
A language of the resource
English
Type
The nature or genre of the resource
Text
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
https://citadeldigitalarchives.omeka.net/items/show/619
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Charleston (S.C.)